Still from ROV video

[Tom Swearengen]

Well----what we 'see' and what the AUV/ROV saw is apparently different. Maybe we they can analyze all the data, things will become clearer.

[Jeff Victor Hayden]

Well----what we 'see' and what the AUV/ROV saw is apparently different. Maybe we they can analyze all the data, things will become clearer.

Shame about not having the GPS co-ordinates from the previous expedition Tom, I thought that might come back to haunt us this time around.
Still, looking on the bright side there's a mountain of data, video and images from this expedition. My hunch is the needle is in there somewhere (and the wire/rope) GPS this time (I assume?)
Nil Desperandum

[Jeff Victor Hayden]

TIGHAR team members Tim Mellon and Andrew Sanger are helping us review the ROV footage collected during the 2010 Niku VI expedition. Our eyes are now tuned to the underwater environment at Niku and able to spot anomalies that previously went unnoticed. We have already spotted something we want our forensic imaging specialist, Jeff Glickman, to look at.


Looks more promising...

TIGHAR cameraman Mark Smith is setting up the high-definition ROV video for review. We need to be able to re-construct the search day by day, moment by moment – knowing when and where any given video image was shot.



Even more useful...

Whatever is down there hasn't gone away. It just remains to identify what it is. High definition will be a great advantage as well as a couple of aircraft blueprints ;)

[Tom Swearengen]

yes Jeff-----was worded to a more positve statement. Hope there are things to look at.

[Jeff Victor Hayden]

Jeff

Dateline: At sea, 24 July 2012

Happy Birthday Amelia! You're 115 years young today and still in the headlines. What more we've learned about your fate remains to be seen. We're headed home with data and imagery that will give us the answer.

At 19:00Z (09:00 KOK) we were at 7°28′ North, 166°55′ West making 8 kts with 981 nm to go. So far the SCRs seem to be holding up (knock wood). Seas and wind have moderated somewhat and we're still hoping to reach port in Honolulu on Sunday afternoon.

The technicians are starting the process of breaking down and packing their equipment for shipment.

The Discovery Channel folks are organizing their many hours of video, transcribing dozens of interviews, and beginning the process of assembling the documentary that is scheduled to air August 19th.

TIGHAR cameraman Mark Smith is setting up the high-definition ROV video for review. We need to be able to re-construct the search day by day, moment by moment – knowing when and where any given video image was shot.

TIGHAR still photographer Laurie Rubin is reviewing and editing thousands of photographs.

I've now received the raw data and various logs, graphics and summaries from Phoenix and have started to wade through them. TIGHAR archaeologist Megan Lickliter-Mundon also has a copy.

TIGHAR team members Tim Mellon and Andrew Sanger are helping us review the ROV footage collected during the 2010 Niku VI expedition. Our eyes are now tuned to the underwater environment at Niku and able to spot anomalies that previously went unnoticed. We have already spotted something we want our forensic imaging specialist, Jeff Glickman, to look at.


http://tighar.org/Projects/Earhart/Niku7/niku7dailies4.html#n723

[Jeff Victor Hayden]

High-definition video footage and imaging will help in distinguishing between target debris and coral debris. As we have seen and, been reliably informed now, it's no picnic down there, no blue lagoon tourist wreck site here. These conditions must influence what we should expect to see. I don't expect to see anything immediately recognisable as aircraft wreckage so, it will be a slow and painstaking exercise to pick out anomolies.
Examples:
Of course engines will be there, maybe in one piece, maybe not but, visible?, buried?, covered in silt? remember, at 1200ft there is 1200ft of erosion above you, heading downwards like a constant rain, landslides won't help either.
Should we expect paint or markings to be visible after 70+ years as well? doubtful if the structure itself couldn't stand up to the conditions what chance paint.
Parts that would be the likeliest to survive?
Plexiglass, a bugger to see though
Larger machined alloy structures, spar, root etc..
Thousands of very small parts scattered around
You have to take into consideration though it will all be scattered about in a debris field, covered in coral, coral residue, silt and so on, not a pretty sight.
Finally as an indicator of the conditions down there they nearly lost the AUV and ROV on numerous occasions and, had to alter the search methods and patterns on a number of occasions to protect them. These 2 machines were under control, any aircraft wreckage down there isn't and, is at the mercy of the elements.
IMHO of course
There's lots to do in the coming months and, time is on their side. Whatever it is isn't going anywhere fast, 70+ years?

[Jeff Victor Hayden]

Just going through the ROV footage again to see if there is anything that has been overlooked/misinterpreted/assumed...
Starting with the 'circle'
Which isn't actually a circle as you can see from the first image. So, what can that tell us about whatever it is/was?
Pliable? not brittle? not one piece? twisted?

[C.W. Herndon]

For quite some time I had thought that there was one of FN's "drift bombs" shown in the ROV video. I think things may have come together now. Previously I was under the impression that the "drift bombs" contained aluminum particles but today I discovered that they could also have contained bronze particles. I don't know what the bronze would look like after a "drift bomb" burst open but I show everyone this for consideration. Here is an article that describes the "drift bombs" and how they worked.
http://tighar.org/wiki/File:Ceramic_Drift_Bomb.jpg

Picture number 1 from the ROV video, in my opinion, may show one of the "drift bombs".

Pictures number 2 and 3 from the ROV video, in my opinion, may show bronze particles and dust from one of the "drift bombs" being stirred up by the ROV thrusters.

Comments?

[Malcolm McKay]

I don't know what the bronze would look like after a "drift bomb" burst open but I show everyone this for consideration. Here is an article that describes the "drift bombs" and how they worked.
http://tighar.org/wiki/File:Ceramic_Drift_Bomb.jpg

What was the "bronze" powder made off? Was it actual bronze or something coloured bronze.

After 70 odd years of immersion in salt water real bronze would be a greeny blue colour and clogged together by corrosion. Are you suggesting that the drift bomb broke open at the time the ROV passed by? I must admit that to me the orange coloured object looks like ordinary seaweed - probably kelp.

[C.W. Herndon]

Malcolm, according to the referenced description of the "drift bomb", below, they were filled with "bronze flakes".

Ceramic or glass drift bombs were filled with aluminum or bronze flakes and dropped over water during daylight, breaking on impact. The metal particles would spread to form a bright reflection which the navigator could follow with the drift sight.

No, I don't think that the "drift bomb" broke open when the ROV passed by. I think that the ROV may have landed on a "drift bomb" and partially broken it open when it did so. Then when the ROV resumed its movement some of the "bronze flakes were stirred up.

This is the only place in either of the ROV videos, that we as members of TIGHAR have been allowed to see, that this type of feature appears. When I view the video, link below, it does not, in my opinion,  look like "seaweed-probably kelp". Please note that the feature occurs very early and very briefly in the video.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8yjeyOTFWX0&feature=plcp

[John Balderston]

If I recall correctly something on the order of five seconds is edited out of the middle of that stirred-up cloud of whatever it is. The explanation of the edit may be as simple as it wasn't relevant to following the wire / rope.  Me, I'm hoping it was more the result of the "Rose Mary Woods" school of editing ;D.  Fingers crossed for big news to come.

[Malcolm McKay]

When I view the video, link below, it does not, in my opinion,  look like "seaweed-probably kelp". Please note that the feature occurs very early and very briefly in the video.

Well at the risk of appearing difficult, to me that just looks like a kelp or sea weed fragment.

[Chris Johnson]

Yes the seconf photo could suggest kelp/seaweed.

What depth was the footage taken at?  If it were too deep then it would just be floating detritus rather than growing kelp/seaweed.

What about it being rust particles from a ferrous object disturbed by the ROV?

Or just a red cloud bunny  :D

[C.W. Herndon]

Yes the seconf photo could suggest kelp/seaweed.

What depth was the footage taken at?  If it were too deep then it would just be floating detritus rather than growing kelp/seaweed.

What about it being rust particles from a ferrous object disturbed by the ROV?

Or just a red cloud bunny  :D

Chris, the estimates I have read in this thread for the depth of the video ranges from 600ft to 300 meters.

Rust particles might explain the orange color but not the shiney flakes floating  around and the fact that the "seaweed" does not show up again. 

[JNev]

Malcolm, according to the referenced description of the "drift bomb", below, they were filled with "bronze flakes".

Ceramic or glass drift bombs were filled with aluminum or bronze flakes and dropped over water during daylight, breaking on impact. The metal particles would spread to form a bright reflection which the navigator could follow with the drift sight.

Did FN carry drift bombs on the Electra?  I am thinking that I read somewhere that they were not useful on that bird because of a lack of a vantage point from which to observe them on the sea once dropped.

Not to drop a wet blanket on this, just something nagging me from Fred's comments (and I can't lay my fingers on the item so far today...).