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Author Topic: Interesting historic things about Miami - relates to 2-2-V-1 study  (Read 71207 times)

JNev

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Re: Interesting historic things about Miami - relates to 2-2-V-1 study
« Reply #15 on: November 18, 2014, 09:28:12 AM »

Good line of thought, John - and limitations are realized, most of us face something like that.  I'd like to say that's in my part of the country - but it's as far for me as Washington D.C. would be, so not an easy weekend jaunt.

Monty takes it pretty seriously - and I happen to know that while he won't brag about it, has many times put his money where his mouth was and is, and generously.

Monty also has experience with getting boots to march for us in remote places - maybe can share a thought or two on how we might do that, and then maybe we can find a way to kick in resources to help it happen?  Maybe we can get more traction with correspondence with someone in the historic arena there, just a thought.  Before we launch anything I'd be eager to see what the latest round of pictures found in Miami yield (and thanks, Monty).

It still seems to me that the number one way to 'proof', if 2-2-V-1 is to ever be proven to have Earhart provenance without the airplane, is good photographic evidence. 

Short of that we'll always be playing against a set of odds that will still include all the unknowables, and some things that might yet prove knowable and disqualifying, like fonts, etc.

But one great picture would be worth millions of words, if it is out there and can be had.
- Jeff Neville

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John Hart

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Re: Interesting historic things about Miami - relates to 2-2-V-1 study
« Reply #16 on: November 18, 2014, 10:04:37 AM »

Yes of course, more pictures will help, but we have a lot already.  Can you imagine sitting in a HS air framing class in 1939 listening to Joe who used to work for XXXX talking about how he helped work on the Earhart airplane?  "You see kids, we did this and that...."

I hope no one, especially Monty gets offended by my statement.  I have the greatest respect for people who put their money where their mouth is and put in the leg work.  But my checkbook is a partnership and my wife wouldn't approve of such an expenditure when we have so many other things we could contribute to.  That is why I do not insert myself too much into the debate here.  But I thought these Miami connections might be of interest to those who can and do.  All I can do is cheer from the sidelines.
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Jerry Germann

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Re: Interesting historic things about Miami - relates to 2-2-V-1 study
« Reply #17 on: November 18, 2014, 02:31:11 PM »

I'm glad that was checked, but have always had doubts about whether this would have been well documented at all anyway.  It looks more like a moonlight special to me - maybe done out of Pan Am's scrap bin by a couple of their guys for a hundred bucks under the table or something.

I think the logical patch-maker is Earhart's own mechanic Bo McKneely with some assistance from the FBO at Miami Municipal, Karl Voelter Inc.
The Pan Am guys had to come all the way from Dinner Key, about a half hour away, and they were instrument and radio techs, not metal benders.
Turns out Karl Voelter kept scrapbooks of his aviation career.  The scrapbooks are now in a Miami archive.  We're making arrangements to have a look at them.


I may have missed an update on this, .....was research accomplished on Mr Voelter's collection?

Below seems to be one example included in Mr Voelter papers;

http://historymiamiarchives.org/online-exhibits/aviation/selling-2.htm

This photo states it was taken one/two days before departure, it appears cropped from a larger capture. However; It may/may not originally include the patch area, and may be taken before the patch was applied.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2014, 02:51:22 PM by Jerry Germann »
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Ric Gillespie

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Re: Interesting historic things about Miami - relates to 2-2-V-1 study
« Reply #18 on: November 18, 2014, 03:32:11 PM »

.was research accomplished on Mr Voelter's collection?
not originally include the patch area, and may be taken before the patch was applied.

We had a researcher check out Voelter's collection but he found relating to AE.  Strange.

Below seems to be one example included in Mr Voelter papers;

http://historymiamiarchives.org/online-exhibits/aviation/selling-2.htm

This photo states it was taken one/two days before departure, it appears cropped from a larger capture. However; It may/may not originally include the patch area, and may be taken before the patch was applied.

Earhart's outfits are helpful in dating photos.  She seems to have worn a different outfit every day.  This is a new one to me.  Clearly a posed photo op.
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JNev

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Re: Interesting historic things about Miami - relates to 2-2-V-1 study
« Reply #19 on: November 18, 2014, 03:36:50 PM »

Good catch, Jerry - thanks for sharing that.  Always find these business-like captures of Earhart interesting - she sometimes looked kinda like Lindbergh in drag.

"Amelia, about that window over your left shoulder... say, that's not a picture of it in your hand, is it?"  Dang it, missed her by... 77 years.

Voelter collection followed up by Ric per this earlier post and now updated.  Too bad we didn't find something.
- Jeff Neville

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Jerry Germann

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« Last Edit: November 18, 2014, 04:53:05 PM by Jerry Germann »
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Ric Gillespie

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Re: Interesting historic things about Miami - relates to 2-2-V-1 study
« Reply #21 on: November 18, 2014, 05:17:47 PM »

I think this one may be same day.....

Yep, right down to the shoes (the ones I think she was wearing when she died.)
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Jerry Germann

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Re: Interesting historic things about Miami - relates to 2-2-V-1 study
« Reply #22 on: November 19, 2014, 12:02:48 PM »

I sent an email inquiry as to the photo, here is the response;

From:  Hugh, Dawn R. (HM) (DHugh@historymiami.org)     
Sent: Wed 11/19/14 11:04 AM

Good afternoon gentlemen,
The original uncropped image that you referenced is in the Karl Voelter collection. You may purchase a digital copy at 600 dpi for $45.00.

We do not have sufficient staff to undertake research for the public, but you are welcomed to visit and research your topic. The Archives is opened from 10am to 4:30pm on Mondays thru Thursdays. The $8.00 entrance fee will give you a pass that is good for a month.
Sincerely,
Dawn Hugh
Archives Manager

101 West Flagler Street

Miami, Florida 33130

305-375-1623 direct

305-375-1492 main

www.historymiami.org

I am not close to the museum, it would be interesting to see the full capture , and to double check to see if any other photos are available ...it seems a large collection, so would be easy to overlook items.  I would be willing to contribute for a restudy of the collection .
« Last Edit: November 19, 2014, 12:14:10 PM by Jerry Germann »
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Ric Gillespie

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Re: Interesting historic things about Miami - relates to 2-2-V-1 study
« Reply #23 on: November 19, 2014, 01:15:26 PM »

I would be willing to contribute for a restudy of the collection .

Thank you Jerry.  Much appreciated.  Your timing is perfect.  Jeff Glickman and I will be flying to Miami December 8 and making copy photos of a collection at the University of Miami first thing the next morning.  We should be able to go the History Miami archive and look at the Voelter collection in the afternoon.  This trip will cost TIGHAR about $1,000 but there seems to be a high potential for some important new imagery.
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Ric Gillespie

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Re: Interesting historic things about Miami - relates to 2-2-V-1 study
« Reply #24 on: November 19, 2014, 01:47:38 PM »

I just talked to one of the associate archivists at History Miami.  Unfortunately, the uncropped photo extends off to the left, not the right.  None of the photos they have digitized shows the right hand side of the plane but there may be photos that have not been digitized.  We'll plan on looking at everything they have.
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Bessel P Sybesma

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Re: Interesting historic things about Miami - relates to 2-2-V-1 study
« Reply #25 on: November 20, 2014, 06:01:46 AM »

From the site linked to earlier, here is a short article of an experimental airplane (piloted by a Harrison R Tucker) damaged during landing round about the same period that Amelia Earhart visited and the Electra received its patch:

http://www.pbase.com/donboyd/image/96824264

Is it too far a stretch of the imagination to think that that aircraft may have been repaired in the same facility that fitted our famous patch?

Unfortunately, Google does not provide much information on Mr Tucker - but perhaps there are other sources out there that could identify him and his plane for us...

As far a legwork is concerned, I would love to dive in, but living on the other side of the pond over in Europe, my opportunities are limited...
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JNev

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Re: Interesting historic things about Miami - relates to 2-2-V-1 study
« Reply #26 on: November 20, 2014, 06:14:37 AM »

Seems worth digging into, nice find.

Maybe I can find a way to get down there if it can help.  I'm enjoying the history that is emerging here.
- Jeff Neville

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Ric Gillespie

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Re: Interesting historic things about Miami - relates to 2-2-V-1 study
« Reply #27 on: November 20, 2014, 07:42:07 AM »

Is it too far a stretch of the imagination to think that that aircraft may have been repaired in the same facility that fitted our famous patch?

Yes.  Different airport.
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Bessel P Sybesma

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Re: Interesting historic things about Miami - relates to 2-2-V-1 study
« Reply #28 on: November 20, 2014, 07:55:48 AM »

Is it too far a stretch of the imagination to think that that aircraft may have been repaired in the same facility that fitted our famous patch?

Yes.  Different airport.

Right, just figured that out for myself! In my defense I'll say the website seems to be a bit confusing.

Just to add to the confusion when searching the net, there is another Miami Municipal Airport in Oklahoma...
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Ric Gillespie

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Re: Interesting historic things about Miami - relates to 2-2-V-1 study
« Reply #29 on: November 20, 2014, 08:02:33 AM »

Maybe I can find a way to get down there if it can help.  I'm enjoying the history that is emerging here.

You're of course welcome to join us.  If you can make it just send me an email and I'll fill you in on the details.
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