Did Earhart carry parachutes on the flight to Howland

[Harry Howe, Jr.]

IRV
We know that neither AE nor FN "bailed out"  Their voices were heard on at least one post loss radio transmission (Betty Klenck, in her notebook, wrote of hearing both of their voices.)

Therefore, if the chutes were loaded onto the Electra at Darwin, as the photo suggests, then the chures were with them when/where they landed (we think that was at Gardner on Friday 7/2.37), unless they threw them off the plane somewhere over the Pacific which is unlikely..

[Irvine John Donald]

Hi Harry.

Naw.  I know they didn't bail. I believe the TIGHAR hypothesis.  Just a point I was making. We need to tie what was on the Electra to the island. We could argue they did or didn't need a fire extinguisher if we wanted to but that's not the point. It's not why they have things on the plane. For us it's "if they did can we find evidence on the island to prove they were there.

[Harry Howe, Jr.]

IRV
A little slow on the understanding here tonight, and of course you are exactly right.  The more we know about what was on the "Flying Laboratory" the better we can analyze what is found on or raound Niku.
(Forehead Slap!)

[Irvine John Donald]

Not you Harry. I could have been clearer. Too many long days at work lately have me not thinking as clearly as I should. Can't get the words out right. In fact I "almost" saw something in the ROV videos. Almost. But gave my head a shake and it cleared up. Just a rock. Phew!!

[Gary LaPook]

Hi Harry.

Naw.  I know they didn't bail. I believe the TIGHAR hypothesis.  Just a point I was making. We need to tie what was on the Electra to the island. We could argue they did or didn't need a fire extinguisher if we wanted to but that's not the point. It's not why they have things on the plane. For us it's "if they did can we find evidence on the island to prove they were there.

But if the parachutes were in the plane when they took off from Lae and IF they landed on Gardner then why weren't the chutes seen by Lambrecht on his flyover? Chutes are perfect for emergency shelters, the chute is 28 feet in diameter and there are 28 lines each about 40 feet long, more than 800 feet of very strong line altogether. Chutes were originally all white but at some point they switched to orange and white for better visibility, I don't know if that was before 1937 or not till WW2. The Gardner hypo has them landing mid-day so they had plenty of time to unload the plane that day and additional opportunities on the following days so it is unlikely that the chutes were left aboard. And why was some trace of them not found when the island was settled only a couple of months later? So, the absence of the chutes on Gardner, if they were in the plane at takeoff from Lae, tends to disprove the Gardner hypo. And the logic is that the chutes WERE in the plane leaving from Lae.

gl

[Ric Gillespie]

So, the absence of the chutes on Gardner, if they were in the plane at takeoff from Lae, tends to disprove the Gardner hypo.

You're doing it again.  You're basing a conclusion on speculation that AE and FN WOULD HAVE done something. The parachutes could have been in the plane and not brought ashore for reasons we can't know.

And the logic is that the chutes WERE in the plane leaving from Lae.

Your opinion.  Not "the logic."

[Tom Swearengen]

Gary---perhaps they didnt THINK to use the chutes :
1) as a shelter from the sun
2) to 'maybe' catch any rain water that may have occured
3) as a search target.

We have seen the amount of 'non-preparation' for this flight ( as we would have done it). But, WE didnt do it, AE and Fred did.
Perhaps, Fred was more injured, and never left the plane. Those are all questions that are still to be answered.
Tom

[Irvine John Donald]

Gary.  You know better than to comment like that.  Ric and Gary's comments are spot on. 

We don't "know" the chutes were on the plane when it left Lae.  They "might" have been based on "what's likely".
IF they were on the plane then we do not have any evidence of what happened to them or IF they were used. 

I am really surprised that you even made that posting. 

[Harry Howe, Jr.]

IMHO
AE/FN probbably had no reason to unload items from the plane right away after landing.   My opinion is that they expected the Itasca to be steaming towards them even as they landed on Gardiner sometime around noon on Friday 7/2/37..  FN probably knew, from his maritime experience, that the Itasca's top speed would be about 20 knots so they could expect it to be coming over the horizon in about 18 hours, i.e. at about 0600-0800 Saturday 7.3.37.

[Gary LaPook]

IMHO
AE/FN probbably had no reason to unload items from the plane right away after landing.   My opinion is that they expected the Itasca to be steaming towards them even as they landed on Gardiner sometime around noon on Friday 7/2/37..  FN probably knew, from his maritime experience, that the Itasca's top speed would be about 20 knots so they could expect it to be coming over the horizon in about 18 hours, i.e. at about 0600-0800 Saturday 7.3.37.

And Noonan's expectation was based on what?

The radio message from Earhart to Itasca saying "we are preceeding to the southeast and will land in the Phoenix islands?"

The radio message from Itasca to Earhart saying "since you are overdue here we will search the Phoenix islands since they are on the LOP you reported?"

Oh, there weren't any such messages. Hum.

gl

[Ric Gillespie]

You're right Gary.  We have no way of knowing what Noonan expected.

[Tom Swearengen]

man---I wish someone could explain the aerial navigation thing for me-------If the wings come out of the Northwest, that would be a left quartering tailwind during the flight, and during the cloud cover during the night, could have pushed the plane on a more southernly course. So at daybreak, Noonan shot his sunline, but they were south of Howland. Tell me how you find your location on the 157/337 line with no reference than open ocean? I'm not trying to be difficult, but apparently Commander Thompson made the same mistake I am---since he searched NORTH of Howland, instead of South. Hense , the search that was conducted, versus the one that could have been conducted. Hindsight is a wonderful tool, but I assure you that history would be much different if Itasca had search Southeast immediately, instead of Northwest..
Tom

[Erik]

Could the parachute explain the white arrowhead feature that was never resolved?  Afterall, it does have about the right dimensions for two parachutes adjoining each other.

Click on this black-and-white picture it will link,  then scroll to the bottom of the page....


Two other links HERE and HERE.

[Ric Gillespie]

If the wings come out of the Northwest, that would be a left quartering tailwind during the flight, and during the cloud cover during the night, could have pushed the plane on a more southernly course.

Storms come out of the northwest.  The prevailing wind in the area is east and northeast, but yes, winds could have pushed the plane south of course.

So at daybreak, Noonan shot his sunline, but they were south of Howland.

So it seems.

Tell me how you find your location on the 157/337 line with no reference than open ocean?

You don't.  That's sort of the point.

I'm not trying to be difficult, but apparently Commander Thompson made the same mistake I am---since he searched NORTH of Howland, instead of South.

Thompson reasoned that if they were south they should have seen Baker Island, so he chose to search north (the whole thing about dense clouds to the north didn't come up until days later). It now appears that they were much farther south than anyone suspected.

[Harry Howe, Jr.]

Gary
As I included in my post   based on FN's maritime experience with the top speed of ships of a certain class, i.e. Coast Cuard Cutters and his ability to divide the mileage 350 nm by speed 18.75 knots and get something like 20 hours.   And his knowledge of the last message AE sent to the Itasca.  (I don't think that it is outside the realm of common sense, mine, uours, or FN's to expect that when they, AE/FN, didn't show up and land that the folks on the Itasca might go looking for them along the line that AE specified 157/337.

Geez, do we have to write a thesis for each post on here?  Chill out and recognize that some things are common sense.

Am I to believe that they landed and immediately kicked into "survival" on  a deserted island mode?