Still from ROV video

[Jeff Victor Hayden]

Marty, the ROV video, and its title 'wire and rope' invites the viewers attention to focus on, well, wire and rope. Of course wire and rope could come from numerous sources and, they look very impressive which of course they must be to survive 75 years under the sea.

What I'm trying to suggest is that we don't know for sure whether the things pictured in the video are 75 years old.

They could be from some yacht that visited any time in the last decade.

Or tuna trawler (see this post for a list of types of visitors to Niku).

Looking outside the box is just as valuable as thinking outside it.

That's true if and only if the thing you seek is outside the box.

Outside the box again Marty ;) The black squiggly thing was getting on my nerves. Trawling through youtube looking for anything on tyre (tire) construction there are numerous videos showing how they are made, even some from the 1930's. Part of the process is to use long thin strips of black rubber in the plying process. These are applied to the structure of the tyre (tire) from huge reels.
At the start of the ROV video we have the circular wire, also part of the tyre (tire) construction process.
Now, I am not saying that these objects are definately part of a tyre (tire) but, the wave action, tides and storms have made short work of the SS Norwich city, what chance would a tyre (tire)on a wheel have?

Jeff

[Brad Beeching]

In the video when the camera first picks up the "wire or rope", deeper down on the cliff face right on the edge of the light field there appears to be what could be more debris.
Also, in looking at the "wire" in the video, without some sort of scale to estimate diameter the best we can do is guess as to what it may be. I realize that alot of folks think the wire is from a tire, but just how likely is a tire to be shredded like that by sea action? Tires are very hard to tear apart unless it was done manually.
If AE/FN ended up there, and what we think we see is what we think it could be, it was once attached to the airplane under the engine. Could the wire be the remains of a flexable duct that maybe was part of the engine accessory section? The ducting of which I speak is treated canvas with a spiral wire inside, if you have ever cut any of this type ducting it would make a piece of wire very much like what appears in the film.
I had the opportunity one time to help out doing some work on a B-25. Inside the nacelles there were several flexable ducts like that, could the Electra had had simular ductwork?

Gums

[Chris Johnson]

In one of the frames there is a bi valve shell clearly visable next to the 'object'.  OK that dosn't give a diffinitive scale but does give a rough idea as its not one of those leg clamping monster shells so popular in 'B' Movies.

[Andreas Badertscher]

Very intersting.
Could it be that part of the tire got disentigrated during the harsh landing hence the black rope thingy? Just a guess.

[Jeff Victor Hayden]

Like Marty said there has been a lot of activity around Niku since 1937 so it's probably to early to jump to conclusions. However it does look quite promising, if only we had the GPS coordinates for the location!
There are a lot of things of interest in the wire and rope video so, the more eyes that step through it one second at a time the better. It helps to look at the whole frame of each second, not just the leading character in it or, as the kids shout out during the panto 'it's behind you' :)
Not saying it's part of the missing plane but, it's the closest I have seen so far. There are more 'objects' that I don't recognise so I will post them for those more familiar with airframe structures.

Jeff

[Jeff Victor Hayden]

Very intersting.
Could it be that part of the tire got disentigrated during the harsh landing hence the black rope thingy? Just a guess.

Hadn't considered that before Andreas, good point. The Electra would still be above water (just) able to transmit with a shredded tyre (tire) I would have thought.
Jeff

[Tom Swearengen]

Ok --wishful thinking on my part--but try this. invert the pic 180*. Without knowing the distance from the ROV to the target, it 'could' it possibly be a main strut and the black 'rope' is the Aeroquip 303 brake hose that runs along the gear to the brakes.
Tom

[Chris Johnson]

Ok --wishful thinking on my part--but try this. invert the pic 180*. Without knowing the distance from the ROV to the target, it 'could' it possibly be a main strut and the black 'rope' is the Aeroquip 303 brake hose that runs along the gear to the brakes.
Tom

Right I know nothing about planes/mechanics and engineering but jumping on the bandwagon have 2 photos.

No1 is of someones plane My Bearhawk patrol

No2 is a still from the ROV

See the right angle bend.  More wishfull thinking I fear.

[Gus Rubio]

I can see the strut shape, but I'm not sure brake hose would be flexible enough to assume such a contorted shape.  Then again, decades under salt water messes with stuff.  There does seem to be an awful lot of "hose" there, though- without looking at pics of the intact landing gear (which I believe are available here on the site), I would imagine there would be only a short length of brake hose on the strut. 

Is there a way to pinpoint where this image was shot, for future visitation?

[Tom Swearengen]

another 'possibility' is that it might be the tailwheel fork. If the empenage assembly broke loose at the rear bulkhead, then it could possibly be part of that. The wire, then could possibly be part of the rudder cables torn loose. The close up in the video slearly shows a wire rope (cable). Whether its aircraft or possibly from something else ( the shipwreck), is anyones else's guess. But it soes seem to have the consistancy of cable, and the lengths possibly indicate control cables of some sort.
It would be interesting to know the ROVs coordinates when these were taken, in relation to the shipwreck and what we think is the landing area.
tom

[Jeff Victor Hayden]

I can see the strut shape, but I'm not sure brake hose would be flexible enough to assume such a contorted shape.  Then again, decades under salt water messes with stuff.  There does seem to be an awful lot of "hose" there, though- without looking at pics of the intact landing gear (which I believe are available here on the site), I would imagine there would be only a short length of brake hose on the strut. 

Is there a way to pinpoint where this image was shot, for future visitation?

I believe the GPS system wasn't working so there's not much hope of finding the exact location again Gus :(
The black squiggly stuff has the appearance more akin to tape rather than hose or rope and it seems to be trapped underneath the object.
Jeff

[Jeff Victor Hayden]

another 'possibility' is that it might be the tailwheel fork. If the empenage assembly broke loose at the rear bulkhead, then it could possibly be part of that. The wire, then could possibly be part of the rudder cables torn loose. The close up in the video slearly shows a wire rope (cable). Whether its aircraft or possibly from something else ( the shipwreck), is anyones else's guess. But it soes seem to have the consistancy of cable, and the lengths possibly indicate control cables of some sort.
It would be interesting to know the ROVs coordinates when these were taken, in relation to the shipwreck and what we think is the landing area.
tom

It seems to be fork shaped Tom for sure. I had a look on the internet for images of the tail wheel assembly but no luck so far.
Jeff

[Jeff Victor Hayden]

Hadn't noticed it before but, reading your posts regarding brake hose/cables on the landing gear strut...


Whatever that is pointed out seems to follow a very similar track to...



Jeff

[Jeff Victor Hayden]

This one

[Tom Swearengen]

I also have been looking around for some pics of the gear on a 10E. The drawings of the Electra may show them---But like Jeff said, there is alot of plumbing and other harnesses in engine nacelles, and gear housings. Sure would be nice to take a close look at an Electra and not things like this. Control cables, hydraulic hoses and rigid tube assemblies for the gear, electrical harnesses, etc.
This part in the video certainly looks like a piece of gear hardware, and may even be apart of the gear pivot point in the wing. may be the tailwheel assembly, that would also pivot for ground steering.
I'm with Jeff, and will get out the CC to donate. I want to see this project succeed!
Tom