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Author Topic: sextant found on gardner  (Read 23843 times)

Mona Kendrick

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Re: sextant found on gardner
« Reply #15 on: December 09, 2011, 02:09:23 PM »

Wikipedia sez the Coconut crabs can live 60 years. The big ones are the old ones.

Wouldn't want to mess with 'em because they become pretty crabby in their old age.
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richie conroy

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Re: sextant found on gardner
« Reply #16 on: December 09, 2011, 03:27:31 PM »

the reason i asked about the sextant is because in the itasca radio logs, amelia mentioned they had dropped to a 1000 feet.

an wondered if that was because the sextant numbers 3500

to withstand, Accurate  readings for altitudes up to 3500 feet above water

an that's maybe wat them numbers meant  ::)
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richie conroy

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Re: sextant found on gardner
« Reply #17 on: December 09, 2011, 03:32:46 PM »

also on the video i posted in "odds of spotting a survivor, reply 134" they are takeing contents out off boxes to make them lighter so eould'nt they have done that with sextant ?
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Gary LaPook

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Re: sextant found on gardner
« Reply #18 on: December 09, 2011, 06:15:25 PM »

the reason i asked about the sextant is because in the itasca radio logs, amelia mentioned they had dropped to a 1000 feet.

an wondered if that was because the sextant numbers 3500

to withstand, Accurate  readings for altitudes up to 3500 feet above water

an that's maybe wat them numbers meant
  ::)
No.

gl
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richie conroy

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Re: sextant found on gardner
« Reply #19 on: December 09, 2011, 06:45:59 PM »

can u take a few min's out to explain to me why not ?

i ask because if u break  down 1 of the wiki entry's

Brandis    3826    4603       eBay    no    Brass plaque on box: "248 US Navy 101009"

if u do it with the numbers, 3500    1542 u get 055 an their is lots ov sextant boxes replica to the one found on gardner an they have  Accurate  readings for altitudes up to 3500 feet above water so maybe it was writ on so u can just take it off shelf in what ever store room, without haveing to open case to check the limitation ov the sextant
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Ric Gillespie

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Re: sextant found on gardner
« Reply #20 on: December 09, 2011, 08:31:00 PM »

Richie, forget it.  The 3500 is simply the chronological "maker's number." It's like a serial number.  The 1542 is the Naval Observatory number.  It's like an inventory number. The numbers have nothing to do with altitude.
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Thom Boughton

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Re: sextant found on gardner
« Reply #21 on: December 10, 2011, 03:19:50 PM »

Wouldn't want to mess with 'em because they become pretty crabby in their old age.


Phew!!!!    ;D





....tb
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richie conroy

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Re: sextant found on gardner
« Reply #22 on: December 13, 2011, 03:07:59 AM »

is it possible the sextant gallagher had in his personal possesion inventory, was in fact the sextant out the box found on gardner ?
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Ric Gillespie

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Re: sextant found on gardner
« Reply #23 on: December 13, 2011, 05:20:34 AM »

is it possible the sextant gallagher had in his personal possesion inventory, was in fact the sextant out the box found on gardner ?

That has been suggested.  I personally doubt it.  How would we ever know?
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Chris Johnson

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Re: sextant found on gardner
« Reply #24 on: December 13, 2011, 05:27:15 AM »

is it possible the sextant gallagher had in his personal possesion inventory, was in fact the sextant out the box found on gardner ?

That has been suggested.  I personally doubt it.  How would we ever know?

He did have a pilots licence so would make sense that he may have had a sextant.  He also seems to have had a compas as well so it is more than lickly that he would have navigational aids.
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Ric Gillespie

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Re: sextant found on gardner
« Reply #25 on: December 13, 2011, 05:37:20 AM »

He did have a pilots licence so would make sense that he may have had a sextant.  He also seems to have had a compas as well so it is more than lickly that he would have navigational aids.

Most pilots do not now, and did not then, own a sextant.  But Gallagher had been through an extensive training regimen at Cambridge University to prepare him for service as a Colonial Service Officer in the Pacific.  It wouldn't surprise me if that training included some basic celestial navigation. 
My main reason for doubting that he would take a sextant found with the bones and keep it for himself is my impression of his character.
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Chris Johnson

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Re: sextant found on gardner
« Reply #26 on: December 13, 2011, 05:41:32 AM »

He may also have needed both the sextant and compass for inter island travel.

As an aside I have recently been wondering what an islander who found a sextant would have done, tell the magistrate? throw it away because of the body? keep it themselves? It does appear that the islanders wern't always forthcoming to the authorities about stuff that they had seen or found.  If the plane wreck was still on the reefs edge and the settlers knew, whay did they not tell Gallagher?
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Ric Gillespie

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Re: sextant found on gardner
« Reply #27 on: December 13, 2011, 05:56:39 AM »

If the plane wreck was still on the reefs edge and the settlers knew, why did they not tell Gallagher?

Good question and, of course, we don't know the answer - but in island folklore the story of the bones being found and the legend of the downed plane are completely separate.  There seems to have been no connection made between the two unusual events at opposite ends of the atoll.
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Irvine John Donald

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Re: sextant found on gardner
« Reply #28 on: December 13, 2011, 07:34:06 AM »

He may also have needed both the sextant and compass for inter island travel.

As an aside I have recently been wondering what an islander who found a sextant would have done, tell the magistrate? throw it away because of the body? keep it themselves? It does appear that the islanders wern't always forthcoming to the authorities about stuff that they had seen or found.  If the plane wreck was still on the reefs edge and the settlers knew, whay did they not tell Gallagher?

I'm intrigued by this too Chris. The plane lands on the reef flat and after 5 days of radio transmission the messages stop. 40 hours after that there is a aerial search by three aircraft and there is no report of plane wreckage. Let's assume the surf action/weather wrecked the plane in that 40 hours.  Let's assume it took the whole week to take an aircraft and wreck it so thoroughly that the wreckage couldn't be identified as a plane by aerial searchers.  Once the plane is wrecked the surf action doesn't stop. It continues to pound the wreckage. For months before anyone comes to settle the island.  So how is it that there was anything left for the natives to identify as a plane wreck?
Respectfully Submitted;

Irv
 
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Ric Gillespie

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Re: sextant found on gardner
« Reply #29 on: December 13, 2011, 08:27:33 AM »

The last credible post-loss message was heard at 8:18 PM Gardner time on July 7.  The Colorado planes were over the island roughly 36 hours later.   The Electra's ability to remain intact on the reef depended upon the height of high tide, the amount of wave action on the reef, and the direction of the wave action on the reef.  Those factors were not constant.  During the week July 2 to July 9 each high tide was getting successively higher.  On July 2 the maximum water depth on the reef in the area where we think the plane was parked (assuming a calm sea) was just under half a meter.  At high tide the evening of July 7 (about two hours before the last credible transmission was heard) the water level was a bit over .7 meter - again assuming a calm sea.  At the next high tide, the water level was nearly .9 meter.  We don't know what the sea conditions were but the combination of significantly higher high tide water levels and rougher seas could mean a far more hazardous situation for the plane.  We also know that, at times,  ocean waves refract around the northwest tip of the island resulting in a southwesterly flow of water over the reef in the area where we think the plane was parked.  Surf coming from that direction would drive an object on the reef toward the edge.  In short, it doesn't take anything more than normal events for the airplane to have survived relativlkey undisturbed for the first several days and then, quite rapidly, be driven over the reef edge. 
A wreck hung up in relatively shallow water in the surf zone could easily be hidden from view on a day like the one pictured in the photo taken during the Colorado overflight but easily visible to someone fishing on the reef edge at low tide on a calm day.
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