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Author Topic: Dust cover and cover plate (Richard Spink, Mili Atoll)  (Read 208771 times)

Craig Romig

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Re: Dust cover and cover plate (Richard Spink, Mili Atoll)
« Reply #105 on: January 14, 2015, 11:19:51 AM »

I agree. They need to show proof that thier pieces came from her plane.
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Bill Mangus

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Re: Dust cover and cover plate (Richard Spink, Mili Atoll)
« Reply #106 on: January 18, 2015, 12:00:08 PM »

Dr. King has an excellent article about all this in his blog:

     http://ameliaearhartarchaeology.blogspot.com/



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C.W. Herndon

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Re: Dust cover and cover plate (Richard Spink, Mili Atoll)
« Reply #107 on: January 19, 2015, 07:32:35 AM »

Bruce, I agree that there was quite a bit of Japanese air activity at Mili during WWII, including both land aircraft fields and a seaplane base. One reason I think the access plate/whatever it is, is Japanese is the reddish paint residue. That strongly resembles one of the more common anti-corrosion paint colors the Japanese used during WWII. Earhart's plane had International Orange on the leading edges of the wings and the top of the stabilizer. That might, might mind you, have weathered to a reddish color in the ensuing seven decades - but that is an awful stretch and one that would be almost impossible to prove, I feel. Her plane did not have any red paint on it that I am aware of.

I posted the sample color chart below in a different thread on this Forum, but maybe it's time to post it again. The picture below came from this site and shows how "international orange" paint looks. I will leave it to each of you to make up your own mind as to whether or not the color could be taken to be "red".
Woody (former 3316R)
"the watcher"
 
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Martin X. Moleski, SJ

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Re: Dust cover and cover plate (Richard Spink, Mili Atoll)
« Reply #108 on: January 19, 2015, 07:38:08 AM »

The picture below came from this site and shows how "international orange" paint looks.

It is an indisputable matter of fact that "people disagree."

If you dispute that fact, you prove that it is true.   :)

People actually disagree about what is "international orange."  See Wikipedia for three examples of the color.

To make your point, you need to go find paint samples from the brand of paint used on AE's Lockheed in 1937.  Random internet colors designed for display on color monitors may or may not accurately show the orangeness or redness of the color used on her aircraft.
LTM,

           Marty
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Ric Gillespie

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Re: Dust cover and cover plate (Richard Spink, Mili Atoll)
« Reply #109 on: January 30, 2015, 10:00:42 AM »

There seem to be two groups pushing this latest Amelia-in-the-Marshalls nonsense.  There's the Lost Flight Group featuring the inimitable Carol Dow and “explorer” Dick Spink, and then there’s Amelia Research, Inc. sponsored by Parker Aerospace.
Sounds like it's going to get crowded on Mili. 
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Bill Mangus

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Re: Dust cover and cover plate (Richard Spink, Mili Atoll)
« Reply #110 on: January 30, 2015, 10:29:53 AM »

Perhaps they're just eager/anxious to get their story out there before the June expedition finds that the Sonar Anomaly is actually the fuselage of the Electra and everyone else's theory evaporates like a puddle in the hot, summer sun.  Hope the Mellon appeal doesn't disrupt the expedition timeline.
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Ric Gillespie

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Re: Dust cover and cover plate (Richard Spink, Mili Atoll)
« Reply #111 on: January 30, 2015, 10:32:57 AM »

Hope the Mellon appeal doesn't disrupt the expedition timeline.

Not a chance.  Nothing associated with the appeal requires my presence.
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Monty Fowler

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Re: Dust cover and cover plate (Richard Spink, Mili Atoll)
« Reply #112 on: March 07, 2015, 10:53:26 AM »

Perhaps they're just eager/anxious to get their story out there before the June expedition finds that the Sonar Anomaly is actually the fuselage of the Electra and everyone else's theory evaporates like a puddle in the hot, summer sun. 

The Earhart Conspiracy Theory Industrial Complex will never allow that to happen, Bill. TECTIC has too many competing agendas to even acknowledge contradictory facts.

LTM,
Monty Fowler, TIGHAR No. 2189 ECSP
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JNev

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Re: Dust cover and cover plate (Richard Spink, Mili Atoll)
« Reply #113 on: April 15, 2015, 08:09:54 AM »

Has it ever occurred to others than myself just how many fine roots have seemingly been cultivated in the soil of Earhart's fame and misfortune by virtue of a very invigorating fertilizer - which is that the lady may very possibly never be found so as to prove one wrong?

It can be very like religion itself: faith, not proof, gathers the masses; belief in the word, not that which is tangible, sustains.  And one may question another's faith only at the peril of needing to prove that which is unprovable: it cannot be proven that the intangible reality that is believed in by the believer does not exist in some humanly unknowable form.

Don't get me wrong - I am a 'believer' in the Spiritual sense... but that's as far as it goes, at least incrementally as I gain a bit more wisdom year by year.

What in the world would having the anomaly emerge miraculously as the L10's fuselage have to do with discouraging those who might well point to the absence of the whole airplane as rich ground for parts to also still turn up elsewhere - as the true place of loss?  At the very least, finding only a portion of the airframe anywhere would certainly feed those still bent on some sort of Japanese-American guvmint conspiracy thing.

For two thousand years there have existed two empty tombs that we know of (well promoted) in Jerusalem (or for at least a significant part of that two millenia).  One is at a 'traditional' site of crucifixion and interment near a 'skull' like place of rock (Golgotha), another in a garden setting and with a rolling stone type of closure - and situated below a rather 'skull' looking limestone hill/cliff (another suggested possible Golgotha).  Both are attended daily by hordes of pilgrims who bow there as kneeling to mark the 'true' place.  Not to confuse the Earhart absence from this veil with that of something on the order of the empty tomb, the point is humans are capable of just so much discernment and understanding; they also attach to that which is comfortable to their own unique psyches - and God Himself help you if you go there to change what they see as rational truth.

If TIGHAR drags up a chunk of Electra from Niku, or conversely, should Stratus do the same from the seabed somewhere, someone, somewhere, will still wonder at the shreds of things pulled from the surf a thousand or more miles away and what it was those people at TIGHAR or Stratus (or you name it) did to 'fake' the true splinter in the wrong place...  8)  ...or, just how was it that TIGHAR or Stratus or whomever couldn't see through what the Japanese did to scatter and hide the evidence of their misdeed.  :P

Seriously, what is it that gets all this focus on this or that faraway island?  I suspect it has to do with an unwillingness to accept the discomfort of an abrupt, violent ending at sea, or at the maw of hungry crabs instead of at the hands of the Japanese, or something. 

If Earhart could only speak... oh damn, now I've opened the psychic door...  ::)
- Jeff Neville

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Joy Diane Forster

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Re: Dust cover and cover plate (Richard Spink, Mili Atoll)
« Reply #114 on: May 28, 2015, 12:16:39 PM »

OK, here's one for those of you who are entertained by the apparently misguided.  I'm pretty sure that the pictured "undisputed piece of Earhart's Aircraft" is not from the Electra....

Enjoy or debunk as you see fit.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/2015/05/150528-amelia-earhart-spink-marshall-islands-aviation/

 :-\
TIGHAR Member #4239
 
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Jeff Lange

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Re: Dust cover and cover plate (Richard Spink, Mili Atoll)
« Reply #115 on: May 29, 2015, 05:15:29 AM »

What I find interesting about his "artifact" is that they say it came from a damaged vertical stabilizer from the crash. I don't recall seeing any damage on the vertical stabilizers in photos I have seen from crash. Anyone else recall any?
Jeff Lange

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Monty Fowler

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Re: Dust cover and cover plate (Richard Spink, Mili Atoll)
« Reply #116 on: May 29, 2015, 05:44:31 AM »

See the Dust Cover and Cover Plate discussion in this same TIGHAR forum: http://tighar.org/smf/index.php/topic,1602.0.html .

LTM,
Monty Fowler, TIGHAR No. 2189 ECSP

Please note: I have merged the last three posts into this thread.  It makes it a little uneven for the reader, but this is where the discussion belongs.   -- Marty
Ex-TIGHAR member No. 2189 E C R SP, 1998-2016
 
« Last Edit: May 29, 2015, 10:06:54 AM by Monty Fowler »
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Jeff Scott

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Re: Dust cover and cover plate (Richard Spink, Mili Atoll)
« Reply #117 on: May 29, 2015, 10:07:16 PM »

OK, here's one for those of you who are entertained by the apparently misguided.  I'm pretty sure that the pictured "undisputed piece of Earhart's Aircraft" is not from the Electra....

What I find interesting about his "artifact" is that they say it came from a damaged vertical stabilizer from the crash. I don't recall seeing any damage on the vertical stabilizers in photos I have seen from crash. Anyone else recall any?

I believe this item may very well be what the article claims it to be (sort of). The caption in the story says "A mechanic saved this original section of aluminum skin from the airplane’s horizontal stabilizer." However, the photo clearly looks like (and I believe the author intended to say) vertical stabilizer.

I have not been able to locate photos from the Hawaii crash that clearly show the aft fuselage and whether there was any damage to either of the vertical tails. However, the photos do clearly show the Electra had a slight roll to the right as it skidded down the runway, which would likely bring the starboard tail into contact with the ground.

Indeed, the official crash report states:

Quote
...The visible damage to the airplane was as follows:- Right wing and engine nacelle severely damaged, left engine nacelle damaged on under side, right hand rudder and end of stabilizer bent. The engines were undamaged. The oil tanks ruptured. ...

Source: http://tighar.org/Projects/Earhart/Archives/Documents/Luke_Field_Crash_Report/LukeFieldProceedings.htm
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Jeff Scott

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Re: Dust cover and cover plate (Richard Spink, Mili Atoll)
« Reply #118 on: May 30, 2015, 02:53:21 AM »

I managed to locate a better view that shows the damage to the right-side tail surfaces. Based on this view, I see how the part in question could come from the lower vertical tail or the outer horizontal tail as well. The paint pattern actually seems to me to better match the wing itself, but it's hard to say exactly where the part comes from without more information.

Regardless, I don't see how it can be rejected out of hand as being unrelated to the Earhart Electra. The description in the article is supported by photos of the accident scene.

The real challenge of the Marshalls expedition is providing evidence that the "half-dozen other parts—jagged, weathered, and corroded aluminum" collected on Mili atoll are a match to the Electra or of World War II vintage. That is no easy feat, as TIGHAR's 25-year odyssey with artifact  2-2-V-1 has demonstrated.
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Andrew M McKenna

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Re: Dust cover and cover plate (Richard Spink, Mili Atoll)
« Reply #119 on: May 30, 2015, 08:02:05 AM »

I don't think anyone is really disputing that the piece pictured in the article, attached here, came from the Electra.  It was apparently salvaged from the dumpster during the repair.

The items from the Marshall Islands that I've seen so far are the "air wheel dust cover" and the "external power port cover plate".    The problem is that the Electra had neither as far as anyone has been able to determine.  Looking at photos of the Electra late in the flight there are no dust covers on either side of the wheel hubs, and the external power port didn't have a cover plate.

There were something like 28 WWII aircraft that went down in and around the Marshall islands near Mili Atoll.  Lots of source material for scrap aluminum and cover plates.

Andrew

Andrew
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