The most perplexing issues

[Jeff Victor Hayden]

Greg, it's not always a few inches of water on the reef...

"The broad, flat expanse of hard coral which surrounds the island's shore dries at low tide to provide a very attractive surface upon which to make a forced landing. However, a disabled aircraft on that reef-flat would, at high tide, be partially afloat in 3 to 4 feet of water. Over a period of a few days tidal cycles would move the aircraft inexorably toward and ultimately over the edge of the fringing reef. From there it's a steep plunge to depths of 2 to 4 thousand feet."

Wasn't it wedged into a groove with the tyre uppermost?

[Greg Daspit]

Greg, it's not always a few inches of water on the reef...

Jeff,
"at the time" the Bevington Photo was taken it had a few inches.
The point of mentioning the few inches was that I could see the axle was high above the water and that the tire did not seem to be in a hole or groove (IMHO). Although that doesn't mean it wasn't at some time.

I think the plane may have moved from a high to low area before it sank off the reef. I am considering that wind may have been more of a factor in pushing it west towards the reef edge than water currents or tide floating it. Norwich City debris seems to head South East towards the lagoon which is consistent with the currents. So why might the plane not move South East as well? Perhaps because wind had more of an effect on the plane because it had wheels and Norwich City debris did not.  Maybe a combination of water current twisting the plane off its wheel chocks allowed it to then be pushed west by the wind. (Edit: more speculation- If this happened they may have tied the chocks to the wheels or used something else as chocks and that is what was helping hold the Bevington object there)

I am also considering the "knee deep" phrase in Betty's Notebook and the lower water levels during Betty's signals in considering that the plane may have moved in stages and was in a lower area during Betty's time than in previous days. For the radio to work and there to be movement of the plane, one possible explanation is wind pushed the plane and water never really got high enough to damage the radio until it was forced into even deeper water.

[richie conroy]

Hi Greg

I am of the opinion that the knee height comment was depth of water outside plane i have attached image of Amelia next to propeller blade

Thanks Richie 

[Greg Daspit]

Hi Greg

I am of the opinion that the knee height comment was depth of water outside plane

Thanks Richie

If the premise is that the water outside the plane was knee deep during Betty's reception and conditions were calm then I think the plane moved from the night before.
Say knee deep is about 1.6 feet
Per Time and Tide, during Betty's reception the tide was as low as -.6 meters (even lower but thats where the chart stops)
The night before the tide was +.75 meters, a difference of 1.35 meters or 4.4 feet from Betty's reception.
4.4 + 1.6 = 6' deep water the night before if the plane did not move.
The dry transmitter constraint is 2'-11 7/16". See fig 8.
I'm not saying your premise is wrong, only that if we accept the premise then the plane either moved or the conditions were not calm. My speculation above was that the water was knee deep outside the plane and it had moved from where it was the night before. See attachment in reply 48 in this other thread

[Matt Rimmer]

On the subject of maps/charts http://www.ebay.com/itm/Strategic-Air-Chart-Map-of-the-Pacific-Ocean-1935-/181195684414?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a301aba3e#ht_838wt_880

Matt.

[Ric Gillespie]

On the subject of maps/charts http://www.ebay.com/itm/Strategic-Air-Chart-Map-of-the-Pacific-Ocean-1935-/181195684414?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a301aba3e#ht_838wt_880

Matt.

Whoa!  VERY interesting.  It's a U.S. Navy Hydrographic Office chart so Fred could have had one of these.  Various air routes are depicted including a couple that use Canton Island in the Phoenix Group as a checkpoint. Gardner is not shown. 

I think we need to have this map in the archive.  Anybody want to bid on it as a contribution?  If not, I will.

[Matt Rimmer]

I can't bid Ric as he's only taking bids from the U.S. and Canada, but I'll put $25.00 "in the pot" who else is with me?.

Matt.

[Dan Swift]

Have to be careful NOT to bid against another member.  Just drive the price up.  Any ideas on how to do that?  Maybe only bid at 15 after the hour and 45 after the hour.  Where have I heard of something like that?  Let me think.  Seriously, don't want to bid each other up.   

6 Days left on this....plenty of time to watch it. 

[Charlie Chisholm]

I can't bid Ric as he's only taking bids from the U.S. and Canada, but I'll put $25.00 "in the pot" who else is with me?

Matt.

I'll throw down $25.

So how do we do that? When we have enough pledged for whatever it costs, Ric buys it and we send in the money as donations?

- Charlie

[Ric Gillespie]

I'll throw down $25.

It's under control.  An anonymous member will do the bidding. Once we know how much it ended up going for I'll let everyone know and you can just make a donation via the website.

[Joshua Doremire]

I suggest esnipe.com and set a bid for what you think it is worth to go through in the last 2 seconds. It will win you over the high bidder before they can bid more. Used it years ago with good results for things I just had to have. Keeps the pre-bidding amount and interest down. In fact they sold the company and it was bought with an esnipe bidder account...  ;D

You could also directly ask the seller to sell it outside of eBay or a private eBay auction esp. if you say what it is for.

[Karen Hoy]

It appears the seller has ended the auction because "the item is no longer available."

:(Karen #2610CER

[Matt Rimmer]

Saw that - disappointing.

I agree. I guess it's a lesson learned, in future with such online "finds" it's probably better to send Ric an email or private message, I feel bad that I didn't do that rather than posting on the forum.

Matt.

[Jeff Victor Hayden]

That's good news. Interesting to note that the maps routes correspond to the South Pacific air ferry route which was initially established in the 1920s to ferry Army Air Service aircraft to the Philippines.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/South_Pacific_air_ferry_route_in_World_War_II

[Rich Ramsey]

Am I the only one that finds it odd that Howland is listed as a stop? I didn't think they started the strip that soon?