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[Jerry Germann]

Hello, I am new to this forum ,and am glad to find a site that shares the same interests in Amelia Earhart and her fate as I do. I have read numerous articles concerning her, as well as read many of the comments here on this forum. I am interested in the various theories regarding the flyers fate , and the one concerning their landing on ( niku) has peaked my interest and has me thinking about a few things , such as ; If Amelia did make a fairly safe landing on the reef, and was able to power up her engines from time to time to maintain radio power, ( possibly for a few days as it has been suggested) I was wondering why she didn't power up the plane to the shoreline /and higher land,and secure it there, Or possibly into the lagoon area, knowing the floatation character of the plane that high tides could or eventually would sweep the plane out to sea?Placed in the lagoon, It would have made the plane easy to see and provide some shelter. I was also wondering has tighar on its expeditions to the island every taken a radio like Amelia had and set up a reciever in the same area as the teenage girl in Florida had and tried to transmit messages to that area? Just thinking..... 

[Tim Mellon]

I was wondering why she didn't power up the plane to the shoreline /and higher land,and secure it there, Or possibly into the lagoon area, knowing the floatation character of the plane that high tides could or eventually would sweep the plane out to sea?Placed in the lagoon, It would have made the plane easy to see and provide some shelter.

Jerry, having visited Nikumaroro, and IMHO as a pilot, I think it would have been folly to attempt to reach the beach by taxing the aircraft from the reef. The intervening waters are pocked with depressions, and getting stuck in one would have possibly disabled the right engine and propeller, preventing any further radio communication. YMMV.

[Jerry Germann]

Hello, Thank you for your reply, I did wonder....was she ALREADY stuck , in the very spot where the photo appears to show the sheared off landing wheel and she couldn't move the plane? In any case if it were me and I knew it was only a matter of time that the tide would soon take my only good shelter and the plane WAS able, I would have taken the chance to get it to shore / or into the lagoon when the inlet was dry at low tide.( even if I had to have fred walk a bit in front while I was slowly bringing her in).  It must have been horrible for them,.... ( in the dark, very little sleep,the intense heat during the day, the unknown creatures that might be on the island, ect). ....I wonder did they spend all their time on the plane until they knew it would be swept away by the rising tide, or did they trek back and forth when the tide allowed?

[Monty Fowler]

....I wonder did they spend all their time on the plane until they knew it would be swept away by the rising tide, or did they trek back and forth when the tide allowed?

Jerry - I can answer that part of your question with a high degree of certainty! Probably not.

I say probably because none of us were there. But consider - It's July. You're just a few degrees from the equator. The sun is overhead for a longgggg time. You get direct heating from the sun on the aluminum of the aircraft plus the indirect heating from the sunlight reflected off the water onto the aircraft. Think barbecue grill with the lid on.

Anything living would be pretty well cooked in short order if it stayed inside the Electra for any length of time. There were few openings for ventilation to create a cross-current of air. The aft cabin door was probably shut to keep the water out (or to try to). Fred's navigation window on the starboard side aft could have been smashed out, I suppose. In the cockpit there were the side windows, which could be slid back, and the top hatch over the pilot's seat. Even all of that combined is not a great deal of square inches of available venting space for superheated air.

LTM, who tries not to vent too much,
Monty Fowler, TIGHAR No. 2189 CER

[Jerry Germann]

Hello, ...yup daytime occupation would have been a definite no,no....anyway I watched a video that Ric had made and in it he said he thought that the electra was only on the reef for 5 minutes until it was swept over the edge, guess that would explain why there aren't too many artifacts on the island , how much could one grab given a few minutes? I was under the assumption that the landing was on dry reef,and later when the tides came in, is when the plane was swept off , however if so that would have taken longer than 5 minutes to happen. In the photo taken of the ( could be landing wheel) it is understandable that it would be upside down, floating like a bobber, with the inflated tire serving as a buoy. Did one of her landing wheels break off upon landing???, possibly , in my opinion that could be one reason she couldn't try to power the plane onto higher ground. I don't know what credence tighar gives to the proported distress calls lasting for several days ( I am not sure where ric comes up with the 5 minute time period). I believe in one person's recalling the transmissons she proported hearing , that she said it sounded like earhart said she was STUCK on a reef. 

[Greg Daspit]

( I am not sure where ric comes up with the 5 minute time period). 

Possibly 5 days on the reef, Not 5 minutes. (maybe once higher tide made it float off the reef it may take 5 minutes to sink). Read Time and Tide and note the times credible transmissions were recieved were mostly during the night and lower tide. I can think of 3 reasons. 1. Propagation may be more favorable at night. 2. It was too hot to transmit during the day. 3. Sought saftey of shore during high tide.
An of course the propeller may not operate at high tide.

[Jerry Germann]

Hello again, I finally got some rest and I have to say .....OOPS! I was watching a video of Ric at 2 in the morning last night and thought he said 5 minutes,  actually he said 5 nights ( boy the brain doesn't work well on little sleep) so forget all that 5 minute stuff in my previous post. Anyway , it brings me back to my previous wonderment , that being ( if she was able to power her craft to higher land why didn't she , was the landing gear broken off on the setdown? If after observing the tides coming and going in for 5 days and nights and seeing the plane surrounded with high water each time ( crossing your fingers that it won't goout to sea with the last wave ) I would think an attempt would have been made to get it to a safer local.

[richie conroy]

Hi Jerry

Ric posted an image a while back of him and other Tighar members sitting on bank at edge of reef which is quite steep an would explain why they never tried to get plane on dry land, But for the life of me i cant find image

Maybe Ric will help us out by re posting it Cough 

[Bruce Thomas]

Hi Jerry

Ric posted an image a while back of him and other Tighar members sitting on bank at edge of reef which is quite steep an would explain why they never tried to get plane on dry land, But for the life of me i cant find image

Maybe Ric will help us out by re posting it Cough 

Richie, rather than get Ric to repost it, just click here to go to the original post back in the early part of summer this year.

[Jerry Germann]

Hello Ritchie and Bruce......I found the picture along with other comments basically asking some of the same things as I have been,....I see what you mean about trying to power it up to the area where the picture was taken ( no go). Are the shores along the whole of the island this way?  That leads to my next question , how is the inlet to the lagoon?, any chance of getting a plane in that way? I am still thinking about Amelia and Fred watching those waves  coming and going day after day during high tides tugging at their precious lifeline....and IF the plane WAS able to move, agreeing with each other in the thought that ,( boy we have to limp our only hope of survival as close to the shore as possible when the tide is out. I wonder concerning the photo  ( since it seems to be the tire held somewhat in place by the heavy iron attached to it), how far did it drift from where it accually separated from the plane?

[Bruce Thomas]

Hello Ritchie and Bruce......I found the picture along with other comments basically asking some of the same things as I have been,....I see what you mean about trying to power it up to the area where the picture was taken ( no go). Are the shores along the whole of the island this way?  That leads to my next question , how is the inlet to the lagoon?, any chance of getting a plane in that way? I am still thinking about Amelia and Fred watching those waves  coming and going day after day during high tides tugging at their precious lifeline....and IF the plane WAS able to move, agreeing with each other in the thought that ,( boy we have to limp our only hope of survival as close to the shore as possible when the tide is out. I wonder concerning the photo  ( since it seems to be the tire held somewhat in place by the heavy iron attached to it), how far did it drift from where it accually separated from the plane?

Jerry, two articles in Ameliapedia will be of interest to you, one about the landing channel and the other about the boat channel. And for trying to divine what Fred and Amelia woulda, coulda, shoulda done in this or that situation, the "Undecidable questions" entry is a good article to keep handy.

[Jerry Germann]

Hello,
           I think that is the fun of forum debates, the wonderment of this ,and that, and the other ... I clicked on the landing channel, however it directed me to the boat channel area , it doesn't give me any insight as to the condition of the inlet (Tatiman passage) to the lagoon from the reef during low tide periods. In your opinion is it possible to power a plane (carefully)   from the assumed landing site and accross the reef surface and into the lagoon? It would have made it possible for Earhart to continue to transmit/ and or listen to radio broadcasts throughout the day/night instead of waiting for low tide periods. Also, I have read in other's comments on the net ,that if she were on this island why didn't she report the large shipwreck next to her downed plane in her broadcasts, giving a major clue to her whereabouts? Another tactical maneuver.

[richie conroy]

Thank You Bruce

I did try finding it on forum but to no avail 

[Ted G Campbell]

Guys and Gales,
If Nessie turns out to be real it should tell us that the landing gear on the left side of the aircraft got stuck in a grove on the tidal plane and it couldn't go any futher up the reef.

Ted Campbell

[Ric Gillespie]

In your opinion is it possible to power a plane (carefully)   from the assumed landing site and accross the reef surface and into the lagoon?

Absolutely not.

It would have made it possible for Earhart to continue to transmit/ and or listen to radio broadcasts throughout the day/night instead of waiting for low tide periods.

No it wouldn't.  The main passage is like a fast-flowing river whenever the tide changes and is about about ten feet deep.  If the plane ever got as far as the passage the transmitter would quickly be flooded. 

Also, I have read in other's comments on the net ,that if she were on this island why didn't she report the large shipwreck next to her downed plane in her broadcasts, giving a major clue to her whereabouts? Another tactical maneuver.

You mean like by saying "Ship on reef southeast of Howland" or transmitting the ship's name over and over?