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Amelia Earhart Search Forum => General discussion => Topic started by: Gary Vance on June 15, 2017, 03:00:56 PM

Title: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Gary Vance on June 15, 2017, 03:00:56 PM
I just saw a quick promo on the History Channel, I think it was called "Amelia Earhart, the Lost Evidence".  It start in July, has anyone heard about this? I wasn't using my DVR so I couldn't back up and take a good look.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on June 15, 2017, 04:46:21 PM
Somebody else saw that too.  Googling it gets nothing but try https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Lost_Evidence

Apparently the History Channel has a series by that name about WWII.  I smell a Japanese Capture show.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Margaret Sanders on June 17, 2017, 09:55:52 PM
Watched Amelia: A Tale of Two Sisters last night on Netflix. The show was well-balanced in that TIGHAR's theory was explained succinctly, and then Ric was given time for rebuttal after others voiced conflicting views. I recommend it!
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Gary Vance on June 19, 2017, 03:20:09 PM
Just caught the end of the new promo. It's on July 9th, I didn't catch the time though.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Andrew M McKenna on June 19, 2017, 07:10:56 PM
According to the web blog "Chasing Earhart" this new show involves Dick Spink, who is one of the folks that is promoting the ditched at Milli Atoll hypothesis.  This is the same guy who claimed to have found parts of an Electra back in 2015(?) including the cover to the external power port and dust covers for the wheel brakes, neither of which existed.

https://www.facebook.com/chasingearhart/

amck
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Gary Vance on June 24, 2017, 09:22:09 PM
Just saw the promo again.  July 9th at 9pm.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Bill Mangus on July 05, 2017, 07:30:37 AM
NBC's Today Show splashed a big story on the History Channel's upcoming special this morning, including a "never before seen" picture of people they say are AE and FN.

Go to NBC News site for complete story and video of this morning's story.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Bryan Tolin on July 05, 2017, 09:04:36 AM
More info....
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/does-this-photo-prove-amelia-earhart-survived-her-final-flight/ar-BBDMSeO?li=BBnb7Kz

uh...yea...
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Bruce Thomas on July 05, 2017, 11:39:02 AM
This is so intriguing! According to the author of this "news" story, Amelia and Noonan left New Guinea at midnight on July 2, 1937, taking off "into the dark, muggy night." <snort> I guess the film of the takeoff was shot through Japanese night-vision lenses!  :D

And I am so relieved to see that the crouching figure on the dock in Jaluit wearing a white shirt clearly shows the humanity of her captors, who let her change out of the dark colored shirt she was wearing when she departed Lae.   ::)
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Bill Mangus on July 05, 2017, 12:45:00 PM
. . . and "Fred" is wearing a white shirt (t-shirt?) and white pants ::)
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Greg Daspit on July 05, 2017, 12:47:37 PM
. . . and "Fred" is wearing a white shirt (t-shirt?) and white pants ::)

Yep, I was thinking the same thing. I’m so happy Fred finally got a new shirt.
That lady in the Muumuu dress is part of a Japanese guard?
Seriously though:
No date on photo.
The whole scene looks very casual. 
The person suggested to be Earhart is not facing the camera and has longer and darker hair than the B&W photo of Earhart
Bottom line you can’t see her, or more likely his, face.
Noonan’s looks were kind of generic and that photo is too blurry to discern any detailed or distinctive features.
What is supposed to be “barge with plane” looks more like a sailboat with a mast and the mainsheet furled on the boom, much like the sailboat to the left.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: James Champion on July 05, 2017, 06:15:23 PM
I've seen a few internet stories, and caught ABC evening news.
Where are the Japanese holding them captive? Where are the Japanese navy ships? This photo is more like that of a trading harbor with no military presence at all. If the person behind the camera was trying to get a picture of rescued aviators, then the photo is a total failure.

With film you did not just randomly snap pictures. Film was expensive, could be hard to buy away from major civilization, cost to develop, and you wouldn't see the results for weeks. I'm just trying to figure out from the composition of the picture what the photographer was trying to capture and why. If the sailboat and the people next to it was the purpose, why not take a few steps forward and frame just those parts. Seems to me he/she was trying to capture a harbor where he/she just arrived with a group of people in a sailboat compared to a ship like he/she would soon depart in as a step of a journey.

If this is Fred and Amelia, then they are only a few yards from finding a custom agent, port authority, shipping company desk, harbor radio station, or somewhere else to send a message or telegram saying they've been rescued, wire money for a ticket. It is not time for sitting on the pier watching the tide come in.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Diane James on July 05, 2017, 07:27:02 PM
Just for the heck of it I went to Bing Images and searched for pics of "receding hairline."   I suppose the hairline on the guy in this picture on the dock could be Fred's...  or a few hundred thousand other guys.

Stories about this pic are all over the network news tonight.  Oh well, there is no such thing as bad publicity. It helps keep Fred and Amelia in the public consciousness, even if it isn't likely so. 

Diane
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Randy Conrad on July 05, 2017, 11:26:54 PM
I was sitting in my living room having a conversation with someone when the news came across that History Channel had new shining information as to exactly what happened to Amelia and Fred in this newly examined photo in the National Archives. You're kidding me right!!! As I was thinking about that... I distinctfully remember sitting in a room with at least 40-50 tighar members during the 75th Anniversary conference 5 years ago and the topic got brought up about having enough fuel to reach the island. Exactly how much fuel she had left in the tank when she landed! Now, if I recall what the director of the Smithsonian Institution comments were and what Gary LaPook mentioned...there is no way remotely possible that Amelia could have reached the area of the Jaluitt Atoll or anywhere possible in the Marshall Islands. This thing too with pictures strummed from the National Archives..is something else. You're gonna tell me that the Japanese government back in 1937 is gonna sit by and allow prisoners of war to sit on a shipping dock and act like nothing is going on. Plus, if this picture is remotely possibly true...then what else is the government hiding from us! Overall, I think its not even close to being true...
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: David Williams on July 06, 2017, 02:10:55 AM
Quote
author=Randy Conrad - You're gonna tell me that the Japanese government back in 1937 is gonna sit by and allow prisoners of war to sit on a shipping dock and act like nothing is going on.

A point of order, you got to remember that there were no POW's in 1937.  WWII did not kick off until September 1939 and America sat on the fence until the Pearl Harbour attack by the Japs in 1942! Japan & US were not at war nor enemies until 5 years after the duo went missing.  IF the photo can be proven to be AE and FN in Jaluit then maybe there could be some merit to them being on a civil 'US Spy Mission' for FDR's administration but I doubt this.

Wherever this photo was found I'm thinking there probably is information in the same file or folder regarding the circumstances of the scene, maybe even some info on the back of the photo. Maybe the people digging this photo up do not want any such info to be published if they have an agenda!!! :o
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Matt Revington on July 06, 2017, 07:43:03 AM
Odd that this got so much attention, all I see is a fuzzy back shot of person who could be AE but who could also any person of either gender with a slim build and medium length hair.  The barge being towed also could easily be many other things, not really sure how they estimated the size with such precision I would think land marks of known distances would be required, is Jaliut harbour identical today so that they could get them.   It is apparently undated.  Really just a misfiled random photo of a harbor  in the Marshal's at some point around WWII .  I think that being misfiled is how it wasn't purged along with all evidence of the Japanese capture theory, of course it may have been properly filed and had nothing to do with AE.

The  "computer forensic examiner is quoted as saying "I can say with more than 99.7 percent confidence that the photo is authentic and untouched,” all that means is that it wasn't photoshopped.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on July 06, 2017, 08:23:47 AM
All good observations.  Is the ship in the background really the Koshu as claimed?
I'm working on an official TIGHAR response to this idiocy, if the phone ever stops ringing.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Kevin Weeks on July 06, 2017, 08:30:02 AM
thanks for approving me Rick. I'm not sure how close this will be, but I did some research into vessels that called into jaluit before WWII. I found a couple steamers in the size range that is shown in the background of the Jaluit harbor image. one was the US ship albatross but it did not fit the profile. the other was the German postal steamer "Germania" it changed hands, companies and names several times over the course of it's life until 1945. this ship seems to match up fairly well with what is seen in the photo. the steamer has records available online of some of it's port of call dates. I found some and will post them up when I get a moment.
here is a link to some information regarding the ship:
http://marshall.csu.edu.au/Marshalls/html/MIShips/Germania.html

Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Kevin Weeks on July 06, 2017, 08:33:15 AM
All good observations.  Is the ship in the background really the Koshu as claimed?
I'm working on an official TIGHAR response to this idiocy, if the phone ever stops ringing.

I would say that is not the koshu in the background. the Koshu appears to be much larger with a different shaped bow entirely.
(https://earharttruth.files.wordpress.com/2015/01/koshu-circa-1918.jpg)
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on July 06, 2017, 09:09:25 AM
The ship in the distance may be the Germania but the ship nearest the wharf does appear to be the Koshu.
Let's see if we can find out when Koshu visited Jaluit.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Matt Revington on July 06, 2017, 10:51:00 AM
When I look at the two pictures that Ric just posted of the Koshu from 1918 and the photo in question it appears there is a structure on the bow in the jaliut photo that is not there in the older photo.  I acknowledge this is at about the same resolution as the "barge" but to me it looks something like a gun battery (terminology?) see in the  japanese destroyer pic i have attached.  I understand the Koshu was a merchant ship that was later retrofitted to be a transport for the Japanese Navy at some point.  If this  is a new gun (a big if) then would the retrofit have occurred by July 1937?
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Kevin Weeks on July 06, 2017, 11:08:27 AM
The ship in the distance may be the Germania but the ship nearest the wharf does appear to be the Koshu.
Let's see if we can find out when Koshu visited Jaluit.

very hard to pick out details on the ship in the distance. similar though. I don't agree with the Koshu too many general size issues. the large rectangular drop side on the bow section does not appear to be on the Jaluit image and the rear transition from the cabin area to the upper rail is radiused on one and square on the other.

When I look at the two pictures that Ric just posted of the Koshu from 1918 and the photo in question it appears there is a structure on the bow in the jaliut photo that is not there in the older photo.  I acknowledge this is at about the same resolution as the "barge" but to me it looks something like a gun battery (terminology?) see in the  japanese destroyer pic i have attached.  I understand the Koshu was a merchant ship that was later retrofitted to be a transport for the Japanese Navy at some point.  If this  is a new gun (a big if) then would the retrofit have occurred by July 1937?

the koshu has gun batteries fore and aft in that image. very hard to tell if there is anything on the other image. I'm not sure when Japan started taking control of the merchant ships for navy use.
Quote
author=Randy Conrad - You're gonna tell me that the Japanese government back in 1937 is gonna sit by and allow prisoners of war to sit on a shipping dock and act like nothing is going on.



A point of order, you got to remember that there were no POW's in 1937.  WWII did not kick off until September 1939 and America sat on the fence until the Pearl Harbour attack by the Japs in 1942! Japan & US were not at war nor enemies until 5 years after the duo went missing.  IF the photo can be proven to be AE and FN in Jaluit then maybe there could be some merit to them being on a civil 'US Spy Mission' for FDR's administration but I doubt this.

Wherever this photo was found I'm thinking there probably is information in the same file or folder regarding the circumstances of the scene, maybe even some info on the back of the photo. Maybe the people digging this photo up do not want any such info to be published if they have an agenda!!! :o

japan had started the second sino-japanese war by 1937 and we were on china's side handing out some harsh sanctions.
the photo does have info written on it, most news outlets have cropped it off.

(https://www.extremetech.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/DockPhoto.jpg)
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Greg Daspit on July 06, 2017, 11:10:14 AM
The vessel behind in the post with the ship at different times (https://tighar.org/smf/index.php/topic,1943.msg41673.html#msg41673) looks the same. It could be a boat they normally have on board.  Look at the bow of the towed vessels. Both have a light spot on it and the profile looks the same. I wonder how big it is and if it could even hold an airplane
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Kevin Weeks on July 06, 2017, 11:29:12 AM
I read a prewar report that after Japan took over the marshal islands at the end of WWI they brought in some sort of aircraft by steamship and were flying it out of the islands.

it seems that Japan did not like any missionaries there so they were all sending reports out trying to get help before japan closed up the missions and kicked them out.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Diane James on July 06, 2017, 11:44:23 AM
I think I'm looking at "love handles" hanging over this person's belt-line, something I doubt Amelia would have had. 
Diane
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Leon R White on July 06, 2017, 12:16:46 PM
I'm going to be running a contest called "spot Amelia."  It will be like 'where's waldo' but without the imagination.  I bet we can find 100 people that look like her in less then a week.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Kevin Weeks on July 06, 2017, 01:42:30 PM
I may have identified the background ship. the Koyo Maru was contracted as a subsidiary mail and cargo line to go to Jaluit after WWI.
https://books.google.com/books?id=Bz4uAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA222&lpg=PA222&dq=%22Nippon+Yusen+Kaisha%22+jaluit&source=bl&ots=PckXnJI17P&sig=W65ke-TtYbXy9WMA5Lh9MzFxhtM&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj6kYWSsvXUAhUJzIMKHVCoCvkQ6AEIMTAE#v=onepage&q=%22Nippon%20Yusen%20Kaisha%22%20jaluit&f=false
Koyo Maru

(http://jpnships.g.dgdg.jp/images/aizawamaru_no22.gif)
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Leon R White on July 06, 2017, 03:44:28 PM
This photo purports to be a diagram of the Koyo Maru.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Leon R White on July 06, 2017, 03:45:36 PM
Here's a comparison of the two photos, Rick.  Even allowing for different distances etc. the ships are close, but not the same it seems to me.  If you enlarge the top ship picture, to make it "closer" and perhaps match the funnel sizes in both pictures,  it definitely is longer then the second one. 

This design is fairly common for that era, and google will cough up a number of 'similar' but definitely different ships.  The 'ship in the picture' has too short a bow to match either the drawing, or the 1918 photo.  On the other hand, the 1918 photo does appear to correspond with the drawing . . .
Or not.

L
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on July 06, 2017, 04:16:15 PM
It's hard to judge the length of the ship in the photo because we're seeing it an an angle.

I'm going to consult the Oracle of Glickman and ask him if they are the same ship.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Matt Revington on July 06, 2017, 04:21:48 PM
All of the Japanese merchant ship's spec can be found here
https://maritime.org/doc/id/oni208j-japan-merchant-ships/index.htm
It's the office of naval intelligence guide to Japanese ships in WWII
The koshu is not listed but many essentially identical vessels, according to another site that cited this manual the koshu was in the 208j classification
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Randy Jacobson on July 06, 2017, 04:25:39 PM
For what it is worth, this from the Daily Mail, UK:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4670468/Photo-showing-Amelia-Earhart-NOT-aviator.html

"But MailOnline had access to this same picture a year ago - and an investigation in the US National Archives established that the photo was among a batch taken after 1940, at least three years after she disappeared."

Randy Jacobson, resident skeptic

Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on July 06, 2017, 04:42:10 PM
Thanks Randy.  If we can verify this, it blows them out of the water.  We need to find out who the MailOnLine "investigator" is.  We need file numbers, etc.
I'll try to contact them.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Kevin Weeks on July 06, 2017, 06:49:24 PM
That would be make more sense than it being randomly misfiled as they claim
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Jon Romig on July 07, 2017, 07:04:35 AM
Saw the New York Times article this morning.
Here is an excerpt:

"Shawn Henry, a former F.B.I. executive assistant director who has been working with History to investigate the photo for about a year, said facial identification experts called it likely that the photos showed Ms. Earhart and Mr. Noonan.
He said the Marshall Islands theory is supported by other evidence, too: pieces of metal that were found in the area and could have come from the Electra; an interview Mr. Henry conducted with an islander who claims to have seen Ms. Earhart around the time of her disappearance; and government records citing reports about Ms. Earhart being imprisoned by the Japanese, though the reports mentioned have not been found.
“When you take it all together, to me, it’s beyond a reasonable doubt. That photograph is just a bow on top of a box of evidence,” Mr. Henry said in a phone interview. “And that bow, to me, just ties it all together.”
He sounded confident — just as confident, in fact, as Ric Gillespie, who may be the best-known proponent of another, entirely different theory."

It is amazing that they can treat this preview of an unseen show on the "History" Channel as having equal weight to Tighar's work. I guess "confidence" is the only measure for truthfulness in news these days. Our president has established that standard.

Ric, you have amazing patience!

Jon
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Matt Revington on July 07, 2017, 07:29:33 AM
From an interview with Les Kinney in the National Post :

"Kinney, who started his career as a naval intelligence agent, said the photograph he found was in a batch of documents collected by U.S. sources in anticipation of the 1944 invasion of the Marshall Islands. “This was a mistake. This was never meant to be there,” he said. The National Archives verified Thursday that the image is from its holdings and was in a file “unrelated to Earhart.”"

So he found a blurry photo in file unrelated to Earhart. As Kevin noted the photo is clearly labelled with what it is,  a view of Jaliut Harbour , which would be useful to have for a planned invasion of the island.  If it was a photo of AE and Electra I would expect that to be included in the label, also if the "barge was important in this view why did the photographer almost cut it off the edge and instead devote half the picture to the other part of harbour and unrelated boats.  This would be like Tighar claiming that Bevington saw the landing gear on the reef but decided to aim his camera at the Norwich City.

http://nationalpost.com/pmn/entertainment-pmn/a-film-claims-to-solve-the-mystery-of-amelia-earharts-fate/wcm/06e438c4-520a-4e3b-acef-af9344f77530
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Kevin Weeks on July 07, 2017, 08:07:29 AM
pictures people can look at generate hits on their web page.. it's not the content that matters it's buzz and revenue they can create.

lets not forget all the airplane parts he found that were no doubt from the electra... but were able to be debunked in minutes by anyone who casually looked at one.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Leon R White on July 07, 2017, 10:47:15 AM
Attached are two quick "perspective warp" versions of the 1918 picture.  This was a 5 minute exercise in Photoshop.  No other mods were made.  This is certainly not conclusive, but evening changing perspective doesn't get the picture to match "the boat in the photo."  These aren't the same ships, IMHO.  In fact, I couldn't find a way to make the two photo's match, no matter what I did.   Just sayin - the photo is about as useful as their airplane parts were.
Leon White
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Friend Weller on July 07, 2017, 12:04:35 PM
Why is (almost) everyone looking at the camera? 

If this was a surveillance or reconnaissance photo, wouldn't the photographer have been a little less obvious?

If it were a "trophy" photo, why was it taken from so far away?   

If it were a press photo, why are the "stars of the show" not readily visible?

Eight out of twelve folks are looking at the camera; it's almost as if the photographer yelled "Say チーズ !"

(That means "cheese"!)
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Bruce Thomas on July 07, 2017, 12:30:25 PM
All of the Japanese merchant ship's spec can be found here
https://maritime.org/doc/id/oni208j-japan-merchant-ships/index.htm
It's the office of naval intelligence guide to Japanese ships in WWII
The koshu is not listed but many essentially identical vessels, according to another site that cited this manual the koshu was in the 208j classification

I suggest that the Koshu Maru is indeed listed in this document. "Koshu" is the Hepburn spelling for Japanese names, but there are other methods of "romanization" for Japanese words which produce varying spellings. On page front003 (https://maritime.org/doc/id/oni208j-japan-merchant-ships/front003.htm) of this document it's stated that:
Quote
The Hepburn system is the most nearly phonetic rendering of spoken Japanese and is still employed by the United States Navy except for merchant ships, where Kokutai is used.

About the middle of the listings on page tail041 (https://maritime.org/doc/id/oni208j-japan-merchant-ships/tail041.htm) there is listed the ship named Kosyu Maru with the alternative Hepburn spelling of Koshu Maru, showing it to have been built in 1911 with a length of 298 feet and a beam of 44 feet.

Looking at page 140 (https://maritime.org/doc/id/oni208j-japan-merchant-ships/pg140.htm), there's a silhouette of a vessel, the Taieu Maru, and the Kosyu Maru is listed as "similar" to that.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Matt Revington on July 07, 2017, 01:48:10 PM
Thanks Bruce I had not considered the translation issues.  There are however 3 Kosyu's  in that document and the one that matches the "1918" picture best is on page 152.

https://maritime.org/doc/id/oni208j-japan-merchant-ships/pg152.htm

It  has the guns that evident in that 1918 picture ( and which are not on the other Kosyu's), it is noted that this a Japanese naval vessel that strongly resembles merchants ships. I am not sure if this is the Koshu that is supposed to be in the Jaliut photo or if there are multiple Koshu's ( Kosyu's) that are confusing people (including me).
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Bruce Thomas on July 07, 2017, 04:08:44 PM
Yes, Matt, but the ship on page 152 is military and so it does not have Maru at the end of its name. The story with the Jaluit quay explicitly says the ship is named Koshu Maru.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Matt Revington on July 07, 2017, 04:16:56 PM
I did not know that Maru was only used for non-military ships.  However I think it is clear that the 1918 ship that we have been trying to match the ship in the photo to is this navy ship on page 152 so if the ship at jaliut was the koshu maru and a merchant ship then we should try to match it to one of the others.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on July 07, 2017, 05:36:27 PM
Jeff Glickman says the ship in the photo is not Koshu.  He'll write up a report next week.

TIGHAR's initial response to the photo is now up on the TIGHAR website at https://tighar.org/Projects/Earhart/Archives/Research/Bulletins/83_JaluitPhoto/83_JaluitPhoto.html
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Bruce Thomas on July 07, 2017, 05:39:22 PM
Matt, you mentioned 3 entries listing Koshu, so there is one other with Maru as part of its name. Its the one with Teishu Maru listed to the right. This vessel was built in 1937 with the original name of Teishu Maru, and seems to have been acquired by the Japanese Navy and renamed to Koshu Maru about 1940. There's a picture of that ship here (http://www.wrecksite.eu/wreck.aspx?138323). So this isn't the one in the Jaluit photo.

They're all starting to look the same to me! But the ship in the Jaluit photo looks old and well-worn in 1937, like the one in the famous poem by John Masefield, "Cargoes": "Dirty British coaster with a salt-caked smokestack."
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on July 09, 2017, 11:43:57 AM
New revised critique at https://tighar.org/Projects/Earhart/Archives/Research/Bulletins/83_JaluitPhoto/83_JaluitPhoto.html

Thanks to Matt Revington for the Kinney confession. 
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: William R Warren Jr on July 10, 2017, 12:27:44 PM
It's hard to judge the length of the ship in the photo because we're seeing it an an angle.

I'm going to consult the Oracle of Glickman and ask him if they are the same ship.

I wish I could offer even rudimentary services at this moment, but two posts above yours, there exists a simple plan and elevation model of the Koshu. Without too many concerns about details, a rough 3D model in *ANY* 3D package that allows modeling (and simple light and camera placement) should give you an idea. The effect people are confusing with the ship being shorter between images is called "foreshortening" and the same effect that makes the ship look shorter also confuses upright details and their placement (so a stack or mast may appear further fore or aft when the miscalculation comes from the beam vs length being miscalculated.) Given the rough dimensions in the 2-view above, a boilerplate 3D model will either match the photo or not. If it does, we pursue the evidence to its logical conclusion (was Koshu ever even there, was it afloat in 1940, bla bla science is yawn so boring) BUT: pursuing this dead end to its logical conclusion and nailing all of its other flaws to the whipping post is what science does!.

TIGHAR is good about getting people interested in the science ... relatively speaking. National Geographic is better at it, but they've been pursuing a wider variety of interests for a century or two more, so that's expected. I find the timing of the "ooh, it's misfiled!" photograph -- mid-Niku-IX -- to be cute. I find the sudden overwhelming (if occasionally frustrating for news-starved members) agreement with aforementioned NatGeo to be probably the smartest partnership ever!! (If the bones were Amelia's, then ...)

Then Fred was buried and may still be there. Or vice-versa. Either way, no smoking gun (yet?) BUT nothing yet that says there's no gun. And (sniff sniff) what's that?
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Dan Swift on July 10, 2017, 12:49:10 PM
Watched the show!  Didn't find anything other than hearsay and theories.  The pic is interesting, but no way to even know when it was taken and who the people are.  They also left out a fairly important evidence.  I am sure because it doesn't support their hypothesis.  It is documented that Amelia transmitted (strong) that they were on a LOP 157-337 and that they were flying north and south.  She did NOT say we are turning west toward the Gilberts.  Convenient omission of the facts.  Also, not much about ALL the post loss transmissions that were received and tracked by credible facilities and pointed to Gardner....not The Marshalls.  Just one by someone who said she heard her say that were at Mili Atoll.  I doubt it.  Somebody said they saw the plane land (or their Father did), somebody said their mother delivered clean linens to a American women in the prison, someone said they performed medical on them, etc., etc.  I could say that Jimmy Hoffa is buried in my back yard.  So why not believe me!!  I have no proof of that either.  Conveniently no bones, no real pictures, no left behind articles, no anything.   
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on July 10, 2017, 01:15:30 PM
We have an urgent need for someone who can read Japanese.  Contact me through the Forum or by email at ric@tighar.org

Sorry for sounding mysterious but we need to confirm something before announcing it.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Randy Jacobson on July 10, 2017, 04:24:54 PM
I do have copies of the Koshu and Kamoi deck logs for July, 1937, but they are in Japanese.  The Kamoi was mentioned in various newpaper articles but it was journeying from the Mariannas to Japan.

I also have a 1951 report that documents the oceanographic water casts, dates, and locations that the Koshu performed during the first half of July, 1937.  Casts were made on July 3-5. Given the last position and assuming 8.6 knots (the average speed between cast locations), the ship would have to have arrived at Jaliut at 0700GMT July 9.  The first official message from the US requesting assistance was on July 11.  The Koshu resumed water casts on July 27, and would have left Jaliut about 1400 GMT July 24.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Rob Seasock on July 10, 2017, 09:58:43 PM
Looks like Samantha Adams cracked the case, image from book published in Oct 1935.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Greg Daspit on July 10, 2017, 10:29:47 PM
Just went though the book after seeing the link on Facebook. Lots of interesting pictures in it. I'm interested what the maps in it indicate as well as an accurate translation for all dates.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ted G Campbell on July 11, 2017, 02:56:11 AM
All,

Amazing, how did the History Channel get a picture that they claim was taken in July 1937 + with the same cast and crew that were in a published book dated 1935 - ?

Take the above question out of the History’s Channel presentation and let’s see where one ins up:  The plane on the barge being towed can not be AE’s plane, AE/FN stated presence in the photo is probably not correct (however, they may have taken an earlier Pan Am Clipper flight to the island - highly unlikely), I believe AE was puttsing around the Atlantic at the time , the face likeness of FN (reversed photo) shows he parted his hair on the right side but earlier pictures shows a left side part, etc.

However, the balance of the History Channel’s presentation does, in my mind, bring up an interesting hypothesis, and that is; could both the TIGHAR and the HC theories be correct!  Think about it; a great deal of radio traffic in the area in July 1937 looking for AE, the Japanese listening in and finally the air waves go silent.  The Japanese see an opportunity and they start a search of their own and find AE on Gardner and the plane down slope on the reef, rescue both but by the time they get back to Japanese territory AE dies and a cover up begins.  Plus, in 1937 early plans by the Japanese were being developed for WWII and the AE issue became an insignificant matter.  There is no way of proving this but it is a great mind bender!

Ted Campbell
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Randy Jacobson on July 11, 2017, 03:58:16 AM
Well done!
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on July 11, 2017, 09:27:29 AM
A quick reminder to the many folks who have recently registered for the Forum:
We have to manually change your account settings before you can post to the Forum and, as you know, you have to be a dues-paying TIGHAR member before we can approve you to post - so, shoot me an email at ric@tighar.org to let me know you've joined TIGHAR so that I can confirm that and get you approved to post.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on July 11, 2017, 09:38:57 AM
the plane on the barge being towed can not be AE’s plane, AE/FN stated presence in the photo is probably not correct (however, they may have taken an earlier Pan Am Clipper flight to the island - highly unlikely),

More than unlikley.  There were no Clipper flights to the Marshalls.

I believe AE was puttsing around the Atlantic at the time ,

In 1935 she was flying from Hawaii to California and from Los Angles to mexico City, then to New jersey.

the face likeness of FN (reversed photo) shows he parted his hair on the right side but earlier pictures shows a left side part, etc.

Fred always parted his hair on the left.

However, the balance of the History Channel’s presentation does, in my mind, bring up an interesting hypothesis, and that is; could both the TIGHAR and the HC theories be correct!  Think about it; a great deal of radio traffic in the area in July 1937 looking for AE, the Japanese listening in and finally the air waves go silent.  The Japanese see an opportunity and they start a search of their own and find AE on Gardner and the plane down slope on the reef, rescue both but by the time they get back to Japanese territory AE dies and a cover up begins.

There is no evidence that anything like that happened.  If it did, who was the castaway?

  Plus, in 1937 early plans by the Japanese were being developed for WWII and the AE issue became an insignificant matter.

Japan was not planning WWII in 1937.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on July 11, 2017, 09:40:04 AM
Hot off the presses:
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Kevin Weeks on July 11, 2017, 12:16:23 PM

Japan was not planning WWII in 1937.


Japan was signing treaties with germany as early as 1936 and was at war in china in 1937... the Rape of Nanking was towards the end of 1937... planning all out war with multiple parties probably not, but they were definitely looking to expand their territory in the pacific.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on July 11, 2017, 12:18:22 PM
planning all out war with multiple parties probably not, but they were definitely looking to expand their territory in the pacific.

Agreed, but the last thing they wanted at that time was war with the United States.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Bruce Thomas on July 11, 2017, 04:21:14 PM
National Geographic has a report (http://news.nationalgeographic.com/2017/07/amelia-earhart-lost-photograph-discredited-spd/) this afternoon on the news of the photograph having been in existence for at least 2 years before Earhart and Noonan's disappearance.

The facial-recognition analyst seen in the History Channel program, quoted in that NatGeo report, seems to dance around the news about the real origin of the photo from 1935:
Quote

"I don't know what to say," says Kent Gibson, the facial-recognition expert that the History Channel hired to analyze the photograph for Amelia Earhart: The Lost Evidence. "I don't have an explanation for why [the photograph] would show up two years early."

In the documentary, Gibson said that based on the facial and body proportions of the two Caucasians, he said it was "very likely" that the photograph contained Earhart and Noonan.

In a phone interview with National Geographic, Gibson added that since the documentary filmed, he has acquired new facial-recognition software that signals a match between the photograph's Caucasian man and Fred Noonan. His previous software had indicated that there were too few pixels in the photograph to successfully perform the analysis. (In a follow-up email, Gibson declined additional comment.)

Newsweek's story (http://www.newsweek.com/amelia-earhart-crash-photo-debunked-635068) about the find of the book containing the photograph ended with a paragraph reporting on the History Channel's response to the surprising find:
Quote
After Tuesday’s break in the case, the History Channel told NPR it was “exploring the latest developments” about Earhart, noting that “ultimately, historical accuracy is most important to us and our viewers.”
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on July 11, 2017, 04:43:42 PM
The 1935 date slams the door.  Their refusal to accept it just makes them look desperate.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Bruce Thomas on July 11, 2017, 05:00:58 PM
If I were that facial-recognition "expert" the next time I went into court to testify, I'd sweat about how the questions of the opposing attorney would rip me a new one. It sounds to me (yes, I admit I watched the show on the History Channel) like this guy got his training from whoever compared Irene Bolam's picture to that of AE.  :D
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Jon Romig on July 11, 2017, 06:27:15 PM
I think TIGHAR did a fantastic job responding to this. My term for this kind of thing is "crazy-making." But TIGHAR showed real class despite the temptations.
And it is all wrapped up and put in the garbage in just two days - how often does that happen?!
Congratulations, and thanks again, to Ric and the team.

Jon
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Diane James on July 11, 2017, 07:46:12 PM
Now to hope... probably in vain... that the media will give the same amount of coverage to the rebuttal as they gave to the "discovery" of this pic and the whole silly story that went with it.

Diane
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Alfred Hendrickson on July 11, 2017, 09:43:27 PM
"Yamano's evidence, which he says he obtained in 30 minutes, undercuts the History Channel's claim that the famed aviator crash-landed in the Marshall Islands and became a prisoner of the Japanese military."

I like that they point out he obtained the evidence in 30 minutes.

 :)
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Leon R White on July 12, 2017, 12:34:43 PM
For the history channel researchers currently reviewing the information (You should be looking here by the way): 
Please note that the "beading" aluminum piece, while it may indeed be 99% aluminum, would have to have been removed VERY VERY carefully to avoid tearing the holes. Proving its aluminum doesn't mean it was on an airplane, doesn't prove it was on her plane,  and the JAPANESE copy of the Electra (they did purchase one, by the way, like the Russians) could have also had the beading. The Japanese didn't NEED a copy of an Electra.  If they wanted to hide hers they could have . . . ah . . . pushed it into the water . . . 

You don't have to love TIGHAR to disagree with this so called "special."  Crap journalism is still crap journalism.  The advertisers should ask for their money back.  Mistakes like these damage all historical efforts.

I think it much more likely that if the so called eye witnesses saw Caucasians, they were missionaries mistaken as spies.  Or, they could have been New Zealanders, Aussies, or Brits who were spies.  But I'll defer to the next history channel special "Aliens who helped Japan loose the war in the Pacific." 

I may be harsh, but the careful wording of the various specialists (except the ex-facial recognition guy) shows this was no accidental mistake.  This was purposeful. I'm dropping the history channel unless they do the right thing now.   Very disappointing.  And thank you to all TIGHARs who are contributing actual facts to this discussion.  And Ric, I need the medication you take to get through these situations.  Please send the family-size 50 gallon jug to my home.

L
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Jim M Sivright on July 12, 2017, 01:04:03 PM
The 1935 date slams the door.  Their refusal to accept it just makes them look desperate.

Has the History(sort of) Channel issued any kind of response to the Tighar's announcement disproving their
theory show? It took the Tighar team, what 2-3 days to prove that the photo was bunk, how long was the production of the show? Don't ya think someone would have at least thought of checking it out first?

Jim #1938R
 
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Leon R White on July 12, 2017, 01:07:16 PM
Google will show a statement that they're reviewing the photo.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Bill Mangus on July 12, 2017, 02:25:26 PM
And it's likely, in my opinion, that's all they'll ever say. 

It's a really a shame how far the History Channel has sunk, putting "breathless journalism" and advertisement revenue above thorough, professional and honest research.  Sad to see someone like Lt Col Hampton led down the garden path by people with a pre-determined conclusion who cherry-picked the stories and ignored all of Tighar's research because it didn't fit with the story they wanted to sell.

Col Hampton should contact Ric if he's interested in learning about the Tighar hypothesis. 
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Andrew M McKenna on July 12, 2017, 10:36:42 PM
Did anyone record this show?

We were out at sea when it was broadcast.  I'd like to see it even though it is not totally debunked.

Andrew
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Russ Matthews on July 13, 2017, 01:37:11 AM
Did anyone record this show?

You may be able to stream it on the History Channel website.

http://www.history.com/specials/amelia-earhart-the-lost-evidence
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on July 13, 2017, 01:51:43 PM
Col Hampton should contact Ric if he's interested in learning about the Tighar hypothesis.

I know Dan Hampton.  I helped him with his recently published book "The Flight - Charles Lindbergh's Daring and Immortal 1927 Transatlantic Crossing" (Harper Collins, 2017).  He gives me a glowing endorsement in the Acknowledgements:
"Ric Gillespie executive director of The International Group for Historic Aircraft Recovery (TIGHAR) made the prologue possible. His exhaustive compilation of reports and personal experiences concerning the disappearance of the White Bird are unparalleled."
I appreciated his compliments and and I hoped to be able to write a glowing review of his book, but it turned out to contain some egregious errors that will be apparent to any pilot. So, as Thumper said, "If ya can't say somethin' nice, don't say nothin' at all."
I had no idea Dan was working with the History Channel on a show about Earhart.  He never asked me anything about it, so don't paint him as a victim.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Matt Revington on July 17, 2017, 12:02:54 PM
If you check the tighar Facebook page you will see a post about a press release from Republic of the Marshall Islands Ministry of Foreign Affairs that claims the dock in the photo was built in 1936 and therefore the date from Japanese book ( of 1935) is wrong.  The information appears to based on the same elders recollections that also recalls the presence of AE and FN.  In my opinion the wooden dock that most of the figures stand on in the photo looks fairly unworn while the road that leads up to it is much more worn.
There are photos online of a much bigger dock present during the German colonial occupation ( see picture 1) around the turn of the century which may have been destroyed in a cyclone that hit the islands.  The second picture (from this website https://sportshop02.ru/Jaluit/0) is titled "The Germania arrives near empty in Jaluit Lagoon about 1911.".  The dock is mostly obscured  in this photo but what can be seen matches up with what is in the history channel photo
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Greg Daspit on July 17, 2017, 02:57:46 PM
If you look at recent pictures of the Jabor or “Jabwor” harbor, there is a dock that looks “L” shaped. If you were looking out from the island the dock has a projection extending from the left side. You can see this in marketing pics as well as google earth. It looks to be made of concrete.

In the older pictures it looks like the sides of the dock are made of wood piles holding back fill.
In the picture published in 1935 there is no extension to the left so it is not “L” shaped at that time and you can still make out the tops of what looks like wood piles. The very end of the dock transitions to a wood deck instead of fill.

I don’t see any tracks/ railway in the picture from the 1935 book but see them in much earlier pictures posted here and on the Facebook page?

Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Jon Romig on July 18, 2017, 08:54:11 PM
Did anyone record this show?

You may be able to stream it on the History Channel website.

http://www.history.com/specials/amelia-earhart-the-lost-evidence

It's not currently on the History channel AFAIK, but someone posted it on YouTube on July 12, probably as a bootleg so who knows how long it will be there. I find it hard to watch because of the sensationalizing.

Jon
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Greg Daspit on July 19, 2017, 10:31:33 PM
https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Dirk_Spennemann/publication/277964781_Typhoons_in_Micronesia_A_history_of_tropical_cyclones_and_their_effects_until_1914/links/5579fdb608ae752158717c7c.pdf

This has a lot of information on the Jabor dock before the 1905 typhoon with pictures of damage to the "Coaling Pier" or "Gesellschaft"(society) pier. It also includes a map showing where the pictures were taken from and names for structures. Starts on page 115.
The wood decked section at the end was destroyed along with the wood structures on the solid section. The wood section at the end looked larger in earlier pictures. Maybe it was rebuilt with smaller dimensions  after the storm. "The Germania arrives near empty in Jaluit Lagoon about 1911" photo Matt Revington posted looks like it has a smaller wood decked end similar, to the one in the 1935 book.  The double bitt bollard at the end also looks in the same place.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on July 20, 2017, 08:19:12 AM
Like the smell of napalm in the morning:
http://variety.com/2017/tv/news/amelia-earhart-1202499852/
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Bill Mangus on July 20, 2017, 08:22:13 AM
First I've heard the authenticity of the book is being question.  Any details?
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on July 20, 2017, 09:02:30 AM
First I've heard the authenticity of the book is being question.  Any details?

Pure desperation.  The date is a librarian stamp, not a copyright.  So?  Why would a librarian stamp the book as being received in 1935 if it was not received in 1935?  The book is not bound but is two-hole punched and the pages secured with cord - therefore the picture could have been added to the book later.  Really?  The rest of the book puts the photo in context with the authors travels.  There is no evidence that any pages were added later.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Greg Daspit on July 20, 2017, 10:03:07 AM
First I've heard the authenticity of the book is being question.  Any details?

The date is a librarian stamp, not a copyright.  So?  Why would a librarian stamp the book as being received in 1935 if it was not received in 1935?  The book is not bound but is two-hole punched and the pages secured with cord - therefore the picture could have been added to the book later.  Really?  The rest of the book puts the photo in context with the authors travels.  There is no evidence that any pages were added later.
In addition to the stamp, if you look on web page 113 there appears to be a printing notice.
http://dl.ndl.go.jp/info:ndljp/pid/1223403/99?platform=hootsuite

This was translated on this forum by "Bonnie". I ran the character she translated as "printing" through an online translator and did translate to "Printing"
https://forums.qrz.com/index.php?threads/busy-time-for-project-amelia-earhart-flyer.572498/page-8
She also talks about the binding being typical.
See PDF for with her translation annotated to what appears be a printing notice at the back of the book.

Edit: Characters provided below that you can copy and insert into a Japanese to English Translator.

昭和 = Showa (Showa 10 is 1935 http://seinenkai.com/articles/dates.html)
十 = ten
年= year

十 = ten
月 = month

五 = 5
日 = day

印 = mark
刷 = printing
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Andrew M McKenna on July 21, 2017, 08:21:59 AM
First I've heard the authenticity of the book is being question.  Any details?

Pure desperation.  The date is a librarian stamp, not a copyright.  So?  Why would a librarian stamp the book as being received in 1935 if it was not received in 1935?  The book is not bound but is two-hole punched and the pages secured with cord - therefore the picture could have been added to the book later.  Really?  The rest of the book puts the photo in context with the authors travels.  There is no evidence that any pages were added later.

A friend of mine wrote the following about all this:

"Good drama and true facts are only occasional bedfellows"

amck
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on July 21, 2017, 08:25:16 AM
A friend of mine wrote the following about all this:

"Good drama and true facts are only occasional bedfellows"

And sadly we have reached a point in our society where we have to make a distinction between "true facts" and the other kind.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Bruce Douglas Evans on July 28, 2017, 12:58:33 PM
How long does it take the "History" Channel to admit it was wrong to make, let alone broadcast the programme?

Bruce Evans
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on July 28, 2017, 01:05:29 PM
How long does it take the "History" Channel to admit it was wrong to make, let alone broadcast the programme?

How long does it take for hell to freeze over?
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Greg Daspit on August 25, 2017, 08:36:41 PM
This environmental assessment has some information on piers at Jaluit.
Page A-21 has a map of what looks like the dock that exists today.
Page A-29 has a map that shows the "Sydney pier" and the "Jabor Dock".
A-30 has a map that indicates the "rubble from Japanese pier"
https://books.google.com/books?id=kDM0AQAAMAAJ&pg=PA17&lpg=PA17&dq=environmental+assessment+jaluit&source=bl&ots=X_0vCXtkQa&sig=4G6bcGgnCbEsFEEvrWs2INdrpxk&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjg9KOm7PPVAhVC5CYKHT56Cg0Q6AEIMTAA#v=onepage&q=environmental%20assessment%20jaluit&f=false
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on September 21, 2017, 12:36:58 PM
We're holding the History Channel's feet to the fire.  We just put this up on the TIGHAR homepage:

The History Channel promised to have their team of investigators “explore the latest developments about Amelia Earhart” – namely, that the photo at the center of their highly-hyped documentary “Amelia Earhart – The Lost Evidence” proved to be from a book published two years before Earhart disappeared. It has now been nearly three months.

Crickets.

No matter which theory of Amelia's fate you favor, fake history hurts everyone.

We ask you to join us in petitioning Paul Buccieri, President of A&E Networks, to broadcast an apology for misleading millions of viewers. To view and sign the petition go to Change.org. (http://chn.ge/2ysyLo4)
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Jerry Germann on September 21, 2017, 02:25:15 PM
http://www.radionz.co.nz/international/pacific-news/339651/cnmi-group-pushing-for-earhart-statue     ::)
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on September 21, 2017, 02:32:04 PM
Heck, they already have a series of postage stamps. Why not a statue?

TIGHAR funded the building of a memorial on Jaluit to the memory of a hundred Marshallese mistakenly killed in a U.S. bombing raid. Maybe we should have built a memorial to Amelia on the dock.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Jerry Germann on September 25, 2017, 06:40:06 PM

TIGHAR funded the building of a memorial on Jaluit to the memory of a hundred Marshallese mistakenly killed in a U.S. bombing raid. Maybe we should have built a memorial to Amelia on the dock.



Would you have a current photo of the memorial, and does it need anything in way of repair or maintenance, so that we may contribute if need be?
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Jerry Germann on September 28, 2017, 08:20:34 PM
https://www.chasingearhart.com/single-post/2017/09/28/A-Hidden-SOS-In-The-Jaluit-Atoll-Photo---Air-Hart-Is-Here

 Good grief!

Interesting how newly captured prisoners could arrange all these events undetected, with hopes that this coded distress signal would be viewed by any would be rescuers in time.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: John Klier on September 29, 2017, 10:36:19 AM
Three things happened after I followed that link.

1. I spit coffee all over my monitor.
2. I checked the calendar to see if it was April 1st
3. I double checked the webpage to make sure I had not been re-routed to The Onion

 ;)

https://www.chasingearhart.com/single-post/2017/09/28/A-Hidden-SOS-In-The-Jaluit-Atoll-Photo---Air-Hart-Is-Here

 Good grief!

Interesting how newly captured prisoners could arrange all these events undetected, with hopes that this coded distress signal would be viewed by any would be rescuers in time.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Greg Daspit on September 29, 2017, 12:11:17 PM
https://www.chasingearhart.com/single-post/2017/09/28/A-Hidden-SOS-In-The-Jaluit-Atoll-Photo---Air-Hart-Is-Here

 Good grief!

Interesting how newly captured prisoners could arrange all these events undetected, with hopes that this coded distress signal would be viewed by any would be rescuers in time.
That is just one of the logic problems. There are too many to list and too many claims without evidence. I thought it was a joke post too but googled the author of the "text".
He has a history ridiculous conspiracy claims including "pizzagate" and others, like where Israelis blew up the space shuttle Columbia.
http://www.4thmedia.org/2013/02/israeli-anti-missile-test-blew-up-space-shuttle-columbia/
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on October 02, 2017, 01:45:50 PM
Good grief!

This kind of thing is stock-in-trade for conspiracy buffs.   This cartoon is from 1993.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Ric Gillespie on October 02, 2017, 02:01:25 PM

TIGHAR funded the building of a memorial on Jaluit to the memory of a hundred Marshallese mistakenly killed in a U.S. bombing raid. Maybe we should have built a memorial to Amelia on the dock.

Would you have a current photo of the memorial, and does it need anything in way of repair or maintenance, so that we may contribute if need be?

No current photo but this is what it looked like when it was completed in 2008. That's TIGHAR's Van Hunn who was in charge of the project being thanked by the mayor of Jaluit.  The inscription, in Marshallese and English, reads:

KOBA MARON
(Coming Together)

Buried here are the remains of nearly one hundred Marhallese men, women, and children who were joined together in death by a tragedy of war on February 1, 1942.
Title: Re: New show on history channel about Amelia Earhart
Post by: Jerry Germann on October 02, 2017, 07:46:47 PM
I think it looks great, and in using Koba Maron( coming together)....excellent!