TIGHAR
Chatterbox => Extraneous exchanges => Topic started by: Martin X. Moleski, SJ on August 02, 2010, 10:31:57 AM
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I noticed that the 296th member of the Forum registered this morning.
Welcome one and all!
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What about the rest of us dues payers?
Ted
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What about the rest of us dues payers?
You're part of the "and all" group, I guess. If you're not among the 296, you wouldn't be able to post here, would you? ;)
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So if I'm not one, I'm "and all", or a dues payer, or not.
Hmmm.
Oh well. It's late.
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So if I'm not one, I'm "and all", or a dues payer, or not.
Hmmm.
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who divide the world into two kinds of people, those who don't, and those who can't count.
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So if I'm not one, I'm "and all", or a dues payer, or not.
Hmmm.
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who divide the world into two kinds of people, those who don't, and those who can't count.
LOL!! :D
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Marty,
Am I missing something? I thought there were more then 296 TIGHAR members.
Ted Campbell
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Ted,
I'm not Marty but since he's gonna be gone for a few days I'll try to pinch hit for him here. There are, I'd guess, a couple thousand TIGHAR members... people who have paid their dues to become involved in the organization. What Marty referred to in his post was the 296 people who have registered on the forum. You don't have to be a dues paying TIGHAR to be a part of this forum. I think Marty would probably say that you have two choices: You can join TIGHAR, register for the forum, or do both. :)
Hope that helps!
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I'm not Marty but since he's gonna be gone for a few days I'll try to pinch hit for him here. ...
Well done!
The reunion continues. I'm just back in Buffalo for a day ...
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Gotshi, I was geting a little concerned.
Ted Campbell
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Hey, here is a question I've pondered a bit since reading and posting to the TIGHAR forum. Any insights/thoughts appreciated.
As has been described, total number of TIGHAR members is in the thousands, and people participating in the forum is now in the hundreds. Related to that, I've spent a bit of time here and there going back and looking over the list and descriptions of the team members of the various Niku expeditions.
Regarding the AE/FN TIGHAR work on Niku and the Earhart forums, here is my question:
Now I'm thinking, if I'm an expedition team member volunteering weeks of time, hard work, and potentially my professional expertise, don't I do that because I'm really into the whole AE/FN lost flight mystery thing? If true, why aren't some of the most active forum participants former Niku team members? Granted, there is at least one historical expedition team member who is responsible for some really thoughtful and meaningful posts, but apparently, most of the historical Niku team members don't seem to participant in the forums at all. Doesn't that seem odd? Seems to me if I'm a team member the more I hear and learn and think about it all the more I can make informed or insightful decisions or even simply enhance my intuition regarding what rock or shell to turn over in the fleeting moments I'm on the ground on Niku.
Who knows, maybe I'm missing something and most of the forum participants are historical Niku expedition members and I'm just missing it. Thoughts/comments anyone?...
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Alan,
I can only speak for myself – a member of TIGHAR since I think 1999. These expeditions are not a “club med” affair. Just the physical demands on oneself going to the island are stressful; once there the stress increases exponentially to the time allotted.
Furthermore, the scientific discipline that has to prevail rules out anyone just “flitting around with his/her nose to the ground” and demands a systematic approach to unearthing anything of value. Value! What is value? What a trained expert sees as something of value would look to the novice as just a piece of junk – for example could you pick out a piece of makeup from the coral, weeds, over wash, etc. lying just below the surface of the ground? I doubt it.
Don’t get me wrong I would give anything to be there with the rest of the team but I know I would be more of a liability than an asset in the process of finding out the facts of AE/FN’s last days.
Just one of the thousands of TIGHAR members that try to support the effort with donations of money.
Ted Campbell
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... most of the historical Niku team members don't seem to participant in the forums at all. Doesn't that seem odd? ...
I suppose they don't find the Forum in its present incarnation to be to their tastes.
I don't have any data to back up this supposition. I'm just guessin'.
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Ted,
Thanks for the reply. Yes, we both apparently absolutely agree.
Time on Niku for expedition team members is often filled with hard labor, blazing heat, ceaseless avoidance of insects and other critters, and generally harsh conditions. No one is saying otherwise. All I'm trying to say is, with all that dedication to the cause, isn't it interesting that apparently those same people don't seem to be participating in the forum? Seems to me, if I had returned from an expedition and read a forum post asking a general question about Niku, I'd be excited to be able to reply as a former "on the ground" observer.
Also, seems to me a person following the forum is possibly going to be better equipped to make thousands of minute, immediate decisions potentially better when on the ground. Although time on Niku is spent following a strict "scientifically determined" schedule, everyone is constantly making judgment calls on things like which path to take to get to the work site, which rock or shell to turn over and which to leave untouched, which item in the mesh screen may be important and which not, and on and on.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to fault anyone. I'm just curious why historical team members seem to apparently not be interested in following the forum. Also, I'd have to guess that in any endeavor a more informed researcher might simply catch things that a less well informed person might miss. For example, recently there was a forum discussion about the "G" feature on Niku. Seems to me having read the forum posts regarding that feature that then when I'm actually there on the ground I might see it or something about it in a different way that possibly unlocks some kind of key that would lead to a meaningful discovery.
That's all I'm saying/asking. Just casually curious as to why team members that volunteer a month of their lives to travel half way around the world for hard work and harsh conditions seem apparently not so interested in the discussions on the forums about the work they've done. That's all. Thanks,
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It does seem rather odd that those expedition members with the exception of a few do not bother to post nor contribute to this forum. It seems that for some reason they have chosen to remain silent and let Ric Gillespie respond to most of the questions from dolts like me. Maybe they are just tired and need a rest. Those expeditions appears to be a very taxing endeavor.
Father Moleski, perhaps you could encourage more input from these experienced and knowledgeable individuals. Of course you have already invited one and all to join so I guess that is all you can do.
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... most of the historical Niku team members don't seem to participant in the forums at all. Doesn't that seem odd? ...
I suppose they don't find the Forum in its present incarnation to be to their tastes.
I don't have any data to back up this supposition. I'm just guessin'.
You could be right!
If you think of a Forum as having a life cycle then this Forum is in its infancy. Asking questions that the ‘old’ Forum had already answered. New members are going over the process of understanding the whole AE final flight and how TIGHAR reached its hypothesis. Hardly essential reading for older hands.
To be fair a number of expedition stalwarts have contributed to the forum and given insights into what happens and how things are.
Marty, Ric and others are always happy to put us newbie’s right and point us in the right direction. Often to the very resources that the web site has to offer.
I’m sure that once the paying members have been privy to the findings of Niku VI and the available bulletins posted on the web then the forum will heat up as help is required from the general public. A good example is the research that was carried out to find out the truth about an artefact that on first inspection appeared to be a knob, see http://tighar.org/Projects/Earhart/Research/Bulletins/38_SecretsKnob/knob1.html
If I’m not mistaken its actual identity was discovered by a non member in the UK.
After a quick search I came up with the gentlemans name. He was called Angus Murray from sheffield, England
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... Father Moleski, perhaps you could encourage more input from these experienced and knowledgeable individuals. Of course you have already invited one and all to join so I guess that is all you can do.
I hate being nagged and I hate to nag others.
Folks from Niku VI have to file their own reports to TIGHAR. TIGHAR and its sponsors have first dibs on the material. Watch for the new TIGHAR Tracks, due soon. Members of TIGHAR (https://tighar.org/membernew.html) get to see TIGHAR Tracks first. It is very nicely printed. Sooner or later, the issue will probably be archived with the rest. (http://tighar.org/wiki/TIGHAR_Tracks)
In the meantime, my hat's off to the TIGHAR teams who have gone to the island. I'm not qualified to do so because I haven't done a field school. (http://tighar.org/Projects/Histpres/courses/courseshome.htm) I also have my doubts about my physical and emotional fitness for the archeology. I'm a pretty good typist and that skill is best employed somewhere within arm's reach of a keyboard. :D
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If you think of a Forum as having a life cycle then this Forum is in its infancy. Asking questions that the ‘old’ Forum had already answered. New members are going over the process of understanding the whole AE final flight and how TIGHAR reached its hypothesis. Hardly essential reading for older hands.
This version of the Forum is definitely in its infancy.
But even the mature e-mail version of the Forum tended to go around in circles as new members tried to get a handle on the relevant data. I compared it to a one-room schoolhouse where all grades were being taught more or less simultaneously.
To be fair a number of expedition stalwarts have contributed to the forum and given insights into what happens and how things are.
Yes. Pay attention to posts by Andrew McKenna. He's one of the stalwarts.
Marty, Ric and others are always happy to put us newbies right and point us in the right direction. Often to the very resources that the web site has to offer.
I'm pretty familiar with the stuff that's on the wiki and I set up a special search page (http://tighar.org/news/help/82-how-do-i-search-tigharorg) to help me get at material elsewhere on the site. There are, at present, 1903 pages listed on the site map. (http://tighar.org/sitemap.html) I haven't read them all, but I'm familiar with the resources that are available.
I’m sure that once the paying members have been privy to the findings of Niku VI and the available bulletins posted on the web then the forum will heat up as help is required from the general public. A good example is the research that was carried out to find out the truth about an artefact that on first inspection appeared to be a knob, see http://tighar.org/Projects/Earhart/Research/Bulletins/38_SecretsKnob/knob1.html
If I’m not mistaken its actual identity was discovered by a non member in the UK.
That is a great detective story. See "The Knob That Wasn't" (http://tighar.org/Projects/Earhart/Research/Bulletins/39_KnobThatWasnt/knob_idbulletin.html) for "the rest of the story."
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Chris,
Excellent point. Yes, lot of truth to that. Possibly the seasoned Niku expedition members see the forum as mostly newbie posts that they've been through long ago. Good insight.
Marty,
My hat is also off to the TIGHAR teams who have gone to the island. I salute them all. However, contrary to what you wrote, I believe given your clear dedication, knowledge, and insight, I would put your on my team any day.
Yes - Andrew McKenna gets a big thumbs up for great, thorough, meaningful posts. Thanks Andrew!
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Marty,
My hat is also off to the TIGHAR teams who have gone to the island. I salute them all. However, contrary to what you wrote, I believe given your clear dedication, knowledge, and insight, I would put your on my team any day.
Thanks for the kind words, Chris Alan (!). But you're meeting me where I'm at my best--all alone in my room, working on a keyboard.
I think I'd be a different animal if you exposed me to rolling seas, tropical sunlight, high humidity, and some wild TIGHARs. :-\
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Marty,
My hat is also off to the TIGHAR teams who have gone to the island. I salute them all. However, contrary to what you wrote, I believe given your clear dedication, knowledge, and insight, I would put your on my team any day.
Thanks for the kind words, Chris. But you're meeting me where I'm at my best--all alone in my room, working on a keyboard.
I think I'd be a different animal if you exposed me to rolling seas, tropical sunlight, high humidity, and some wild TIGHARs. :-\
Those were Alans kind words but i echo them as well :)
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Those were Alan's kind words but i echo them as well :)
Message fixed; mind still needs work. :P
At any rate, I'm glad you guys are here, contributing to the Forum. That's the positive takeaway for me.
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Yes - Andrew McKenna gets a big thumbs up for great, thorough, meaningful posts. Thanks Andrew!
Alan - Thanks. I remember when I was first starting up the TIGHAR food chain, I was pretty hungry for details of what it was like to get to, and be on Niku, so I try as best I can to convey what it is like in enough detail to satisfy the thirst of others. Glad to hear that what I've written is appreciated.
Part of the problem is one of time management. All the expedition Team members are also on the EPAC, and some are also involved with the Maid of Harlech and /or the Devastator projects, so many of us receive a flood of email traffic through those channels. At times, it can be overwhelming, 30-50 emails a day on top of seeing what is new on this forum, trying to do some research on the projects, keeping up with our own personal and professional lives, not to mention making up for taking a month off to go to Niku. I only just recently managed to look through all 3000+ unread email that came in while I was gone, and have been working like mad to catch up since my return on June 15th and the week of jet lag that followed. I still need to unpack some of my gear from the boxes it was shipped home in. Several Team members have simply found to be information overload, and don't have the time to keep up with it all. The Forum, unfortunately, seem to be one of the loads that gets shed first.
Thankfully, Marty seems to be one who can successfully manage the flood, and he's done a great job of filling the void and providing information to the Forum.
Marty - maybe there is or should be a way to ask questions of specific team members, and see if we can get direct responses from those individuals who don't normally peruse the Forum. If there are specific questions, we can post them on EPAC and ask the Team member to answer on the Forum. Just thinking out loud.
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... maybe there is or should be a way to ask questions of specific team members, and see if we can get direct responses from those individuals who don't normally peruse the Forum. If there are specific questions, we can post them on EPAC and ask the Team member to answer on the Forum. Just thinking out loud.
Team members who are willing to be questioned can create Forum accounts; then other registered Forum members can send them private messages.
I haven't come across any questions yet that I felt should be brought to EPAC. I do drag stuff from EPAC to the wiki from time to time, when it seems appropriate to to do so.
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297 to date.
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up to 339 now, the TV programme sure has had an effect
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up to 339 now, the TV programme sure has had an effect
Very definitely. There has been a very noticeable surge in traffic all across the site. The first page of the Ameliapedia (http://tighar.org/wiki/Ameliapedia) has gotten about 11,000 hits in the last week.
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4 more members to 400 :)
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4 more members to 400 :)
This thread started on 2 August 2010.
I haven't got a plot of the rate at which people have joined, but my feeling is that many have come in because of the Discovery TV show and subsequent news reports.
As they are said to have said on the X-Files (I've never watched the show myself), "The truth is out there"--and I know where it is. All I would have to do is fire up phpMyAdmin, collect the registration dates from the database, and make up a chart in a spreadsheet.
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64 new members in December!!!
19 so far in January
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This is kind of a test post (first post, anyway). After pouring over this forum the last few days, it is interesting Ric seems to be the only person who has been on site at Nikumaroro (or who will say so) who posts here. I'm a little confused as to why this thread is in the extraneous "test post" forum and not in one of the regular forums, as it does seem to be a relevant question related to the search for AE.
I must admit I didn't see the Discovery Channel show yet, but was aware of TIGHAR the last few years and I did read Ric's new book last year, which ultimately led me here. Fascinating stuff!
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... I'm a little confused as to why this thread is in the extraneous "test post" forum and not in one of the regular forums, as it does seem to be a relevant question related to the search for AE. ...
Thread drift happens. I have split a few threads and moved them to the right location, but I'm not going to try to clean up every mess people make.
FWIW, here is my own "New Member Introduction," (http://tighar.org/smf/index.php/topic,235.msg1918.html#msg1918) located in the proper place in the Forum.
I have never applied to become a Niku team member for two reasons:
- I have not done an Archeological School, which is a prerequisite for Niku volunteers.
- I think I would be more of a liability than an asset to the team. I am fat, self-centered, and irascible. I don't have any affection for the tropical sun nor am I equipped with what the social graces needed by the team.
I am a reasonably good typist. I have a knack for decoding instruction manuals and help pages. My computer skills are good enough to support most of what TIGHAR wants to do with the website.
I set up the software for the Forum and am the active moderator in it. To come back to the topic of this thread, it seems that we have 3654 posts in 345 topics by 463 members. My total time logged in is 7 days, 22 hours and 12 minutes. I have made 662 posts (0.935 per day). As Alan warned in his reply to your question, I have been known to indulge in sarcasm, irony, and ridicule.
The earliest post the Forum that I can find is Fri, 28 Jul 2000 (http://tighar.org/Projects/Earhart/Archives/Forum/Forum_Archives/200007.txt). That means that I'm sneaking up on my twelfth year of poring over the materials TIGHAR has accumulated. It's been a great adventure. :)
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I am fat, self-centered, and irascible. I don't have any affection for the tropical sun nor am I equipped with what the social graces needed by the team.
Are you quite sure you wouldn't be a good fit? These attributes could all be addressed in a series of petty squabbles aboard a ship towards Nikumaroro, no? 8)
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I am fat, self-centered, and irascible. I don't have any affection for the tropical sun nor am I equipped with what the social graces needed by the team.
Are you quite sure you wouldn't be a good fit? These attributes could all be addressed in a series of petty squabbles aboard a ship towards Nikumaroro, no? 8)
Undoubtedly the would be. That's why I'm confining my ministry to more comfortable islands (Manhattan, Staten, and Long). :P
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I have never applied to become a Niku team member for two reasons:
I have not done an Archeological School, which is a prerequisite for Niku volunteers.
I think I would be more of a liability than an asset to the team. I am fat, self-centered, and irascible. I don't have any affection for the tropical sun nor am I equipped with what the social graces needed by the team.
OMG Marty, you haven't changed a bit in, geez, how many years since I've been away?
Haha! First time back in the forum in years and I am laughing already. I suppose I had better toddle over to the chatterbox thread ind introduce myself.. ;D
AHA !!! Now I know why I didn't rejoin when the forum changed. I couldn;t get past this damned verification thing.
Th' WOMBAT