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Author Topic: Contemporary news coverage  (Read 10135 times)

Gary LaPook

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Contemporary news coverage
« on: December 25, 2011, 12:38:21 AM »

I have attached a compendium of stories concerning Amelia Earhart from all the 1937 issues of TIME Magazine.
gl
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Bruce Thomas

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Re: Contemporary news coverage
« Reply #1 on: December 25, 2011, 10:43:59 AM »

I have attached a compendium of stories concerning Amelia Earhart from all the 1937 issues of TIME Magazine.
gl
How very interesting -- after all the back-and-forth recently on the Forum about whether there was a sextant aboard the plane, or just an octant -- that the post-loss story in the July 19, 1937 issue has this: 
Quote
Before the hop-off, when capable Navigator Noonan inspected what he supposed was an ultra-modern "flying laboratory," he was dismayed to discover that there was nothing with which to take celestial bearings except an ordinary ship sextant. He remedied that by borrowing a modern bubble octant designed especially for airplane navigation.
Someone on the Forum recently posited that perhaps a sextant was part of the equipment with which the airplane was stocked, rather than an instrument belonging to FN.  I wonder if there is independent evidence of such a purchase, perhaps a receipt with manufacturer and Naval Observatory numbers!
LTM,

Bruce
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« Last Edit: December 28, 2011, 07:15:09 AM by Bruce Thomas »
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Gary LaPook

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Re: Contemporary news coverage
« Reply #2 on: December 26, 2011, 12:39:16 AM »

I have attached a compendium of stories concerning Amelia Earhart from all the 1937 issues of TIME Magazine.
gl
 
Quote
Before the hop-off, when capable Navigator Noonan inspected what he supposed was an ultra-modern "flying laboratory," he was dismayed to discover that there was nothing with which to take celestial bearings except an ordinary ship sextant. He remedied that by borrowing a modern bubble octant designed especially for airplane navigation.
Someone on the Forum recently posited that perhaps a sextant was part of the equipment with which the airplane was stocked, rather than an instrument belonging to FN.  I wonder if there is independent evidence of such a purchase, perhaps a receipt with manufacturer and Naval Observatory numbers!
When you read something like this you know it must be true, after all how could the writer have just dreamed up such a detailed story, who would expect a magazine writer to have even heard of octants and sextants so he must have heard this story from somebody "in the know." But the story is apocryphal nonetheless.

Noonan joined the Earhart team on March 12, 1937 only five days before the flight to Hawaii. Manning had joined in early February. On February 17 and 18 Earhart flew the plane from Newark to Burbank with Putnam and Manning was in the back practicing his celestial navigation. At one point Manning computed their position as being over southern Kansas and Putnam was upset with this report since they were actually over Oklahoma and this made Putnam have doubts about Manning's abilities as a flight navigator. Manning had been taking celestial observations in order to derive these positions.

When we say mariner's sextant, the word "mariner's" refers to using it at sea and both Kansas and Oklahoma are far from any sea. A mariner's sextant uses the visible sea horizon as the reference for measuring the height of the sun and stars and it is useless for that purpose over land. Manning was using an aviation bubble octant for these observations and this was almost a full month prior to Noonan meeting with Earhart and agreeing to fly with her. Because of Putnam's doubts they decided to contact Noonan.

I have attached several photos of Manning using a bubble octant and this was before Noonan was hired. I don't know the exact date that these photos were taken, it might have been on the flight from Newark to Burbank or later, on March 10th, when they flew the plane over the ocean to test Manning's navigation. I have also attached a photo of Manning using the MK II B pelorus, drift meter. Marine sextants had been used by several pioneering aviators for oceanic flights in the 1920's but after bubble octants, designed specifically for flight navigation, had been perfected in the early '30s, nobody used marine sextants anymore for oceanic flights.

So we have proof that the Earhart team had a bubble octant prior to Noonan's arrival on the scene so the story in Time Magazine was wrong and probably the result of somebody playing a joke on the reporter.

Noonan first flew in the plane on March 13th and didn't like the bubble octant that they had, it was a Bausch & Lomb instrument and he was used to using a Pioneer instrument at Pan Am, so arrangements were made to borrow a Pioneer instrument from the Navy and this is the Pioneer octant, serial number 12-36, that was carried on the flight to Hawaii and that Noonan signed a receipt for on March 20th while they were embarked on the Malolo for the return to the mainland after the Honolulu crash. Here is a link to photos of the Pioneer octant so that you can compare them for yourself the photos of the Bausch & Lomb octant shown in the Manning pictures. Here is a link to more information about the Pioneer octant.

gl
« Last Edit: December 26, 2011, 09:26:00 PM by Gary LaPook »
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Gary LaPook

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Re: Contemporary news coverage
« Reply #3 on: December 26, 2011, 06:34:35 PM »

I have attached a compendium of stories concerning Amelia Earhart from all the 1937 issues of TIME Magazine.
gl
 
Quote
Before the hop-off, when capable Navigator Noonan inspected what he supposed was an ultra-modern "flying laboratory," he was dismayed to discover that there was nothing with which to take celestial bearings except an ordinary ship sextant. He remedied that by borrowing a modern bubble octant designed especially for airplane navigation.
Someone on the Forum recently posited that perhaps a sextant was part of the equipment with which the airplane was stocked, rather than an instrument belonging to FN.  I wonder if there is independent evidence of such a purchase, perhaps a receipt with manufacturer and Naval Observatory numbers!
Noonan first flew in the plane on March 13th and didn't like the bubble octant that they had, it was a Bausch & Lomb instrument and he was used to using a Pioneer instrument at Pan Am, so arrangements were made to borrow a Pioneer instrument from the Navy and this is the Pioneer octant, serial number 12-36, that was carried on the flight to Hawaii and that Noonan signed a receipt for on March 20th while they were embarked on the Malolo for the return to the mainland after the Honolulu crash. Here is a link to photos of the Pioneer octant so that you can compare them for yourself the photos of the Bausch & Lomb octant shown in the Manning pictures. Here is a link to more information about the Pioneer octant.

gl
There was nothing wrong with the Bausch & Lomb octant and it was used by the U.S. Air Corps until the end of WW II. It was such a good instrument that an identical copy was made by the Japanese and also used by their flight navigators through the end of WW II! Noonan just had a personal preference for the Pioneer octant that he had used to using when flying for Pan Am and when teaching navigation for Pan Am. The B&L was originally developed by the National Bureau of Standards and was patented in 1929 and then manufactured by Bausch & Lomb. I have attached several pages from the U.S. Air Force Navigator's Information File (1945) discussing the use of both the Pioneer octant, the A-7, and the B&L, the A-8A. There is one of the Japanese exact copies of the B&L for sale right now on Ebay and the photos available there are the best I have seen of the B&L and its type of box.


I have attached the photos for this instrument.

Here is a link to an actual B&L so that you can compare.
gl
« Last Edit: December 26, 2011, 09:27:22 PM by Gary LaPook »
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Irvine John Donald

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Re: Contemporary news coverage
« Reply #4 on: December 27, 2011, 09:05:12 AM »

I have attached a compendium of stories concerning Amelia Earhart from all the 1937 issues of TIME Magazine.
gl
 
Quote
Before the hop-off, when capable Navigator Noonan inspected what he supposed was an ultra-modern "flying laboratory," he was dismayed to discover that there was nothing with which to take celestial bearings except an ordinary ship sextant. He remedied that by borrowing a modern bubble octant designed especially for airplane navigation.
Someone on the Forum recently posited that perhaps a sextant was part of the equipment with which the airplane was stocked, rather than an instrument belonging to FN.  I wonder if there is independent evidence of such a purchase, perhaps a receipt with manufacturer and Naval Observatory numbers!
When you read something like this you know it must be true, after all how could the writer have just dreamed up such a detailed story, who would expect a magazine writer to have even heard of octants and sextants so he must have heard this story from somebody "in the know." But the story is apocryphal nonetheless.

Noonan joined the Earhart team on March 12, 1937 only five days before the flight to Hawaii. Manning had joined in early February. On February 17 and 18 Earhart flew the plane from Newark to Burbank with Putnam and Manning was in the back practicing his celestial navigation. At one point Manning computed their position as being over southern Kansas and Putnam was upset with this report since they were actually over Oklahoma and this made Putnam have doubts about Manning's abilities as a flight navigator. Manning had been taking celestial observations in order to derive these positions.

When we say mariner's sextant, the word "mariner's" refers to using it at sea and both Kansas and Oklahoma are far from any sea. A mariner's sextant uses the visible sea horizon as the reference for measuring the height of the sun and stars and it is useless for that purpose over land. Manning was using an aviation bubble octant for these observations and this was almost a full month prior to Noonan meeting with Earhart and agreeing to fly with her. Because of Putnam's doubts they decided to contact Noonan.

I have attached several photos of Manning using a bubble octant and this was before Noonan was hired. I don't know the exact date that these photos were taken, it might have been on the flight from Newark to Burbank or later, on March 10th, when they flew the plane over the ocean to test Manning's navigation. I have also attached a photo of Manning using the MK II B pelorus, drift meter. Marine sextants had been used by several pioneering aviators for oceanic flights in the 1920's but after bubble octants, designed specifically for flight navigation, had been perfected in the early '30s, nobody used marine sextants anymore for oceanic flights.

So we have proof that the Earhart team had a bubble octant prior to Noonan's arrival on the scene so the story in Time Magazine was wrong and probably the result of somebody playing a joke on the reporter.

Noonan first flew in the plane on March 13th and didn't like the bubble octant that they had, it was a Bausch & Lomb instrument and he was used to using a Pioneer instrument at Pan Am, so arrangements were made to borrow a Pioneer instrument from the Navy and this is the Pioneer octant, serial number 12-36, that was carried on the flight to Hawaii and that Noonan signed a receipt for on March 20th while they were embarked on the Malolo for the return to the mainland after the Honolulu crash. Here is a link to photos of the Pioneer octant so that you can compare them for yourself the photos of the Bausch & Lomb octant shown in the Manning pictures. Here is a link to more information about the Pioneer octant.

gl

Gary, could the octant Manning was using have been his own device?  So when he left the team, the team no longer had an octant. When Noonan joined then he may have discovered the team had expected him to supply his own octant or sextant.  Is everyone in agreement that one was borrowed from the air force?  If the team had an octant and FN just wasn't comfortable with it to the point he borrowed one then what happened to the team owned octant? 
Respectfully Submitted;

Irv
 
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Harry Howe, Jr.

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Re: Contemporary news coverage
« Reply #5 on: December 27, 2011, 11:11:54 AM »


Bruce
With respect to the posting about perhaps a sextant/octant was included in the original equipment purchase , presumably under Purdue procurement, I proposed that in a posting in RadioReflections/Re:Why wasn't Gardiner identified in the Radio Messengers? <on December 20, 2011, 2011, 04:02:45 PM.  I don't know the posting number.
No Worries Mates
LTM   Harry (TIGHAR #3244R)
 
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Gary LaPook

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Re: Contemporary news coverage
« Reply #6 on: December 27, 2011, 11:20:47 AM »

I have attached a compendium of stories concerning Amelia Earhart from all the 1937 issues of TIME Magazine.
gl
 
Quote
Before the hop-off, when capable Navigator Noonan inspected what he supposed was an ultra-modern "flying laboratory," he was dismayed to discover that there was nothing with which to take celestial bearings except an ordinary ship sextant. He remedied that by borrowing a modern bubble octant designed especially for airplane navigation.
Someone on the Forum recently posited that perhaps a sextant was part of the equipment with which the airplane was stocked, rather than an instrument belonging to FN.  I wonder if there is independent evidence of such a purchase, perhaps a receipt with manufacturer and Naval Observatory numbers!
When you read something like this you know it must be true, after all how could the writer have just dreamed up such a detailed story, who would expect a magazine writer to have even heard of octants and sextants so he must have heard this story from somebody "in the know." But the story is apocryphal nonetheless.

Noonan joined the Earhart team on March 12, 1937 only five days before the flight to Hawaii. Manning had joined in early February. On February 17 and 18 Earhart flew the plane from Newark to Burbank with Putnam and Manning was in the back practicing his celestial navigation. At one point Manning computed their position as being over southern Kansas and Putnam was upset with this report since they were actually over Oklahoma and this made Putnam have doubts about Manning's abilities as a flight navigator. Manning had been taking celestial observations in order to derive these positions.

When we say mariner's sextant, the word "mariner's" refers to using it at sea and both Kansas and Oklahoma are far from any sea. A mariner's sextant uses the visible sea horizon as the reference for measuring the height of the sun and stars and it is useless for that purpose over land. Manning was using an aviation bubble octant for these observations and this was almost a full month prior to Noonan meeting with Earhart and agreeing to fly with her. Because of Putnam's doubts they decided to contact Noonan.

I have attached several photos of Manning using a bubble octant and this was before Noonan was hired. I don't know the exact date that these photos were taken, it might have been on the flight from Newark to Burbank or later, on March 10th, when they flew the plane over the ocean to test Manning's navigation. I have also attached a photo of Manning using the MK II B pelorus, drift meter. Marine sextants had been used by several pioneering aviators for oceanic flights in the 1920's but after bubble octants, designed specifically for flight navigation, had been perfected in the early '30s, nobody used marine sextants anymore for oceanic flights.

So we have proof that the Earhart team had a bubble octant prior to Noonan's arrival on the scene so the story in Time Magazine was wrong and probably the result of somebody playing a joke on the reporter.

Noonan first flew in the plane on March 13th and didn't like the bubble octant that they had, it was a Bausch & Lomb instrument and he was used to using a Pioneer instrument at Pan Am, so arrangements were made to borrow a Pioneer instrument from the Navy and this is the Pioneer octant, serial number 12-36, that was carried on the flight to Hawaii and that Noonan signed a receipt for on March 20th while they were embarked on the Malolo for the return to the mainland after the Honolulu crash. Here is a link to photos of the Pioneer octant so that you can compare them for yourself the photos of the Bausch & Lomb octant shown in the Manning pictures. Here is a link to more information about the Pioneer octant.

gl

Gary, could the octant Manning was using have been his own device?  So when he left the team, the team no longer had an octant. When Noonan joined then he may have discovered the team had expected him to supply his own octant or sextant.  Is everyone in agreement that one was borrowed from the air force?  If the team had an octant and FN just wasn't comfortable with it to the point he borrowed one then what happened to the team owned octant?
Although anything is possible (Martians could have spirited Earhart away, we learn real quick not to ask that question of witnesses on the stand) it is highly unlikely because bubble octants cannot be used on ships due to the rapid motions (compared to planes) of the ship, roll, pitch, yaw, heave, sway and surge that makes the bubble move around so rapidly and so far in every direction that is is unusable.

The Pioneer was borrowed from the Navy.
gl
« Last Edit: December 27, 2011, 06:00:55 PM by Gary LaPook »
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Irvine John Donald

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Re: Contemporary news coverage
« Reply #7 on: December 27, 2011, 11:43:11 AM »

In a court of law I would know the answer to the questions I ask the witness. But I'm not in a court of law. I'm on a computer forum discussing what people believe "might" have happened to Amelia Earhart. What do you think happened Gary?  I don't know what your answer is and since its not a court maybe you could drop the lawyer cover and say what you think.   But we should stick to the facts and the evidence. I don't believe anyone can say Martians were involved as there is no evidence.  Come on Gary. You DO have a theory right?  Or are you just saying TIGHAR isn't right to be stubborn.  Even the Grinch warmed up so I have hope for you. (you smiled at that didn't you?)
Respectfully Submitted;

Irv
 
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