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Author Topic: Dr. Berry's Freckle Cream  (Read 415181 times)

Alan Harris

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Re: Dr. Berry's Freckle Cream
« Reply #420 on: November 04, 2012, 04:32:46 PM »

The timber cutters, so far as I can see, we're there briefly for minor ship repairs.  Most ships, so far as I can see, weigh anchor off the stern of the Norwich City so as to provide a stable point from which to launch boats into the current for a landing.

The logging has been discussed before.  I imagine Tom was relying on items such as the following:

The manager of the company, Captain Allen, "made several visits to Gardner for the purpose of cutting and loading timber for ship repairing but no other use was made of the island."
This sounds not like a quick pit stop to cut a tree and patch a leak, but more like cargo loads of wood being cut and hauled off for use in boatyards.   In those days of "manual labor only", Captain Allen might well have had sizable work crews occupied on Niku for several days per visit.

What kind of timber?

Timber cutting visits!
Kanawa is a good 'hard wood' tree and certainly good for shp repairs.
Buka and Ren are softer wood, less likly candidates?
If Kanawa was the tree of choice puts them in the vacinity of Kanawa Point and The Seven Site unless these areas account for whats left on the islands from those expeditions.
This agrees with my own impressions gleaned from long-term reading of articles and posts that: (a) of the available indigenous wood species, kanawa was the most suitable for ship/boat structure; and (b) kanawa was neither plentiful nor universally distributed over the island.  (My "impressions" are of course not facts.)

Further as to location:
The Seven Site is the narrowest part of the island that was habitable.  Historical photos show that in 1937 it was open kanawa and buka forest.

All the above suggest to me that Tom's speculation is not completely far-fetched or unreasonable.

Finally,

These industrious loggers, these rough and ready men, hauling off the entire forest of Kanawa from the island, aren't likely to have had rouge and a compact.
I don't see that Tom anywhere claims either deforestation or that the loggers would be responsible for all the artifacts including cosmetics . . . c'mon now, let's keep 'em above the belt . . ?
« Last Edit: November 04, 2012, 04:53:46 PM by Alan Harris »
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Joe Cerniglia

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Re: Dr. Berry's Freckle Cream
« Reply #421 on: November 04, 2012, 06:03:43 PM »

The timber cutters, so far as I can see, we're there briefly for minor ship repairs.  Most ships, so far as I can see, weigh anchor off the stern of the Norwich City so as to provide a stable point from which to launch boats into the current for a landing.

The logging has been discussed before.  I imagine Tom was relying on items such as the following:

The manager of the company, Captain Allen, "made several visits to Gardner for the purpose of cutting and loading timber for ship repairing but no other use was made of the island."
This sounds not like a quick pit stop to cut a tree and patch a leak, but more like cargo loads of wood being cut and hauled off for use in boatyards.   In those days of "manual labor only", Captain Allen might well have had sizable work crews occupied on Niku for several days per visit.
I read the passage to mean they were repairing their own vessel.  Perhaps this minimizes it, but if you are going to camp out there, you'd need to make use of a great many things on the island. The article states, "No other use was made of the island." I spent a good hour of my time attempting to locate the source of this article to read in its entirety.  Does anyone have the source link?  When were the loggers there?


What kind of timber?

Timber cutting visits!
Kanawa is a good 'hard wood' tree and certainly good for shp repairs.
Buka and Ren are softer wood, less likly candidates?
If Kanawa was the tree of choice puts them in the vacinity of Kanawa Point and The Seven Site unless these areas account for whats left on the islands from those expeditions.
This agrees with my own impressions gleaned from long-term reading of articles and posts that: (a) of the available indigenous wood species, kanawa was the most suitable for ship/boat structure; and (b) kanawa was neither plentiful nor universally distributed over the island.  (My "impressions" are of course not facts.)

Further as to location:
The Seven Site is the narrowest part of the island that was habitable.  Historical photos show that in 1937 it was open kanawa and buka forest.

All the above suggest to me that Tom's speculation is not completely far-fetched or unreasonable.

Finally,

These industrious loggers, these rough and ready men, hauling off the entire forest of Kanawa from the island, aren't likely to have had rouge and a compact.
I don't see that Tom anywhere claims either deforestation or that the loggers would be responsible for all the artifacts including cosmetics . . . c'mon now, let's keep 'em above the belt . . ?

The deforestation quip and the compact association was a tongue-in-cheek remark.  I thought it would be seen as funny.  If it offended anyone, I apologize.

I was about to write that the archaeological record has very little to say about these loggers, but given the 2 sheets at least of overlapping corrugated material at the Seven Site, sheet metal remnants on the surge ridge, Laxton mentioning a house built for Gallagher in his article for the Journal of the Polynesian Society (but not his memorandum as Lands Commissioner), I suppose it's possible. Invoking Occam may not be sufficient to dismiss the possibility entirely loggers were at the Seven Site.  But one would think, if there, they might have inscribed their presence in that record a bit more vocally than it appears they did.  Where are the logging tools, perhaps?

We certainly have nothing from an archaeological standpoint that would make me immediately think of loggers at the Seven Site.  If the operation was large, what type of equipment would it entail? The items representing technology at the site generally seem rather miniature, not oversized as I would expect logging equipment to be.  And some things are broken apparently to serve other purposes.

By the way, when I mentioned Lucite earlier, I didn't mean the Plexiglass matching in curvature and thickness a window glass from an Electra; I meant 3 little pearlescent tines apparently broken off from a base. The point of one is broken off.  They have been interpreted at various times as having come from a large comb.  Whoever was living at the site seems to have been awfully concerned about appearances.

Joe Cerniglia
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Jeff Carter

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Re: Dr. Berry's Freckle Cream
« Reply #422 on: November 12, 2012, 06:14:16 PM »

What sources and quotes support Amelia's concern about her freckles?  I found only the one on Google.

From Amelia: A Life of the Aviation Legend, by Goldstein and Dillon.  This refers to the New York ticker tape parade after the "Friendship" flight:  "As photographers snapped, several spectators, eager for a glimpse of the famous bob, sang out 'Take off you hat, Amelia!' She made a little face, but obligingly removed her modish straw cloche. Tossing it to Muriel, she remarked ruefully, 'Here's where I get sixty more freckles on my poor nose, I guess!'" (page 62)

Are there other quotes I can search for.  Thanks.
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Joe Cerniglia

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Re: Dr. Berry's Freckle Cream
« Reply #423 on: November 13, 2012, 06:20:19 AM »

What sources and quotes support Amelia's concern about her freckles?  I found only the one on Google.

From Amelia: A Life of the Aviation Legend, by Goldstein and Dillon.  This refers to the New York ticker tape parade after the "Friendship" flight:  "As photographers snapped, several spectators, eager for a glimpse of the famous bob, sang out 'Take off you hat, Amelia!' She made a little face, but obligingly removed her modish straw cloche. Tossing it to Muriel, she remarked ruefully, 'Here's where I get sixty more freckles on my poor nose, I guess!'" (page 62)

Are there other quotes I can search for.  Thanks.
The  quotation you cite above is the best of all of them.  It comes from Earhart's only sibling, Muriel Earhart Morrisey.  Morrissey wrote a biography of her sister, "Courage is the Price" in which she (as Dillon's primary source) references the ticker tape parade incident, wherein Earhart complained of the sixty more freckles on her nose she would receive if she removed her cloche.

There are other references where Earhart obliquely refers to various skin problems brought on by sun, by open cockpits, by weather, etc.  Earhart may have been accustomed to using euphemism in the instances when she actually complained about her skin and appearance.

Here is a list of mostly primary historical references to Earhart's concern with her skin I have found:
1) Page 94 of Amelia Earhart's 2nd book "The Fun Of It" has Earhart saying that the goggles she wore would cause her to look like a "horned toad" after the sun exposure she was receiving.

2) October 11, 1928 Omaha Morning World-Herald article, wherein Earhart asked for advice from actress Eve Casanova on her "weather-beaten appearance" from sun exposure, of which she was "ashamed."

"How do you prevent sunburn and keep that lovely complexion?" Miss Earhart wanted to know. "I get so burned and tanned that I'm sometimes ashamed of my weather-beaten appearance."

3) A blog article, wherein a distant relative recalled a family lore that Earhart was not only concerned with her freckles, she could be irascible about them if the discussion turned in that direction:

"We get updates because Amelia is a relative on my paternal grandfather's side. Not a super close relative...only a second cousin or second once removed or something...I can't rememember exactly. But, after my grandmother died, my dad became the contact for this side.

My grandmother never knew her personally, but my grandfather and his brother met her a couple of times during her childhood...I really wish I could remember exactly how that shirt-tail relation works in the geneology..."

"Oh, Amelia really did HATE her freckles. It's something my grandfather remembered about her because he mentioned them to her (thought she was quite adorable) when she was little and she became irate!"

4) Earhart's mother kept a bag of sun creams on hand should Earhart ever return.  Google "Earhart's mother kept suitcase" in Google Books for the citations.

5) Earhart's description of preparations for the 1928 flight, wherein she said she typically packed a tube of cold cream for "cracked lips" as part of her "irreducible minimum" of cometics. 

The Earhart biographer who appeared to devote the most attention to Earhart's self-consciousness about her appearance was Doris Rich. Her book is titled Amelia Earhart: A Biography, and is available from booksellers and Amazon.

Joe Cerniglia
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tom howard

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Re: Dr. Berry's Freckle Cream
« Reply #424 on: November 13, 2012, 10:08:39 PM »

Joe you know as well as anyone how a word or two changed from a quote makes a big difference in meaning in the whole.
You state that in preparation for her 1928 flight, Amelia Said she typically packed a tube of cold cream for cracked lips as part of her "irreducible minimum" of cosmetics." You, quoting Earharts letter.
That is not what the letter states. In fact she never mentioned the word COSMETICS at all. She said she was carrying an irreducible minimum of TOILETRIES"

Big difference.

Webster defines Cosmetics as " changing or beautifying the appearance of skin"
Toiletries can be for either beautification or personal hygiene.

Earhart makes it clear she was only carrying for hygiene, as she stated the cold cream was  "NOT FOR PULCHRITUDE" (beauty), but chapped lips. She wanted that clear.

So despite efforts to link Earhart to Rouge, cosmetics, makeup mirrors, the  letter you linked to states she was carring none on that flight, nor fretting about it.
In fact the letter states she did not worry about appearance on the flight, "the men do not", she said. Nothing was ever mentioned about one single cosmetic. Cracked lips can cause infections and discomfort, a toothbrush is to avoid tooth and gum infections and decay, and a comb is necessary to keep hair out of her eyes. Tissue to wipe away fluids no doubt. That was her "irreducible minimum of Toiletries"

So while it may seem picky to point out a word, since Tighar's theory states they found cosmetics, I am sure that was just a slip for you to put the word cosmetic in summarizing Earhart's statement letter.

For the rest of her relatives recollections of Amelia being concerned with her sunburns and freckles and skin, I have never seen a woman yet that was not concerned with their skin.
Yet, Amelia made it a point in the letter you linked, to say that she was bringing NOTHING to do
with beauty, vanity, or the appearance of her skin.

So yes, she was a woman. She cared about her skin. She also inferred she wasn't worried about it during the fllight record you referenced. Maybe she did an about face, and brought a full makeup kit on her last flight. On her 1928 trip, she was clear there was no cosmetics. 

« Last Edit: November 13, 2012, 10:20:05 PM by tom howard »
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Joe Cerniglia

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Re: Dr. Berry's Freckle Cream
« Reply #425 on: November 14, 2012, 05:33:15 AM »

Tom,
I'm a TIGHAR researcher, not an attorney.  There seems to be a popular misconception that TIGHAR researchers' every post is a Q.E.D, in other words, something that sets out to prove, as in a mathematical theorem, that which was proposed to be demonstrated.  I make no such claim.  For myself, I don't find it particularly rewarding to chase down items such as those relating to Earhart's preoccupation with her skin as a means to establishing a smoking gun. If I expected at every turn such a thing to materialize I would be endlessly disappointed.  I do find it rewarding, rather, to try to build a preponderance of evidence.  Tom King wrote recently that "often it is a preponderance of evidence - no single piece of it determinative - that causes historians and archaeologists (among others in the humanities, sciences, and social sciences) to conclude that a hypothesis is correct." 

You draw a sharp wide gulf between cosmetics and toiletries. The toiletries and cosmetics industry is often linked as a combined set, so no, I don't think it amiss to have used the example of Earhart's personal log of the 1928 flight.  This is a primary source.  In emphasizing the words "not for pulchritude," you did not also state that the cold cream was part of an "irreducible minimum," which I translate to mean she would not consider some personal care item for dry skin to be an item that could be reduced or eliminated from consideration on a long flight. It also seems to me that a product fitting that description was found at the Seven Site.

To my understanding, the items I listed above referencing Earhart's concern with her appearance, complexion, and skin have never before been collected in one place.  They are not - I say again - a Q.E.D., but they are supportive of the notion that Earhart, in the words of one Earhart biogrpaher "did think her skin was unattractive...flying left her no escape from exposure to sun and wind. Her face was frequently sunburned, freckled, and sometimes peeling."

I would add that I don't think we're going to be able to tie particular brands of cosmetic items to Earhart. The document could emerge to do this, but probability doesn't tip that way.  This should be well understood so that any impression that we labor under false hopes is dispelled.

Jeff Carter asked a simple question, and I provided the best answer based on years of research, that I had. The answer may not be sufficient to a standard you set, it may not be conclusive, but it might be indicative to some of a curious set of coincidences, or in the words of one of our esteemed contributors, a "marker of some kind," no more and no less.  It is the accumulation of these markers that makes the case one of preponderance of evidence, not one of beyond all reasonable doubt.  I must add in talking about this preponderance, I'm not referring to cosmetic items such as the evidence in favor of a compact at the Seven Site.  I'm referring to the entire Nikumaroro hypothesis, and the evidence there is a good deal more intricate and involved than a few bottles of putative cosmetics.  While I labor to dispel the notion that I work under false illusions of success, I would also like, as I hope I just did, to dispel any notion that, while I do specialize in bottles, that I emphasize a few pieces of evidence at the expense of all others.  And there are many others than just the ones mentioned here.

Joe Cerniglia
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Randy Conrad

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Re: Dr. Berry's Freckle Cream
« Reply #426 on: November 14, 2012, 10:24:51 PM »

Nicely said Joe! In reference to what was mentioned, I would like to add my two cents to this matter. Several months back, I recall a forum member making the account that everytime they saw a picture of Amelia, there were no imperfections. If I remember right, the member and I looked back into old photographs and found only one. Even going clear back into her childhood Amelia was very very adament about her complexion and very very serious about everything she did. If you look into old documents and whatnots of what she has done in history, you will truly find that this is a woman of caliber. Yeah, she may have not been the best pilot to land a plane..but the woman did have guts and we admire her for that. She has set a precupus for all women, young and old. Anyway, the comment was made that Amelia supposedly never carried cosmetics with her on the plane. I truly disagree with that. Simply, because she had her so-called fan base and those of high dignitaries all over the world. Heck...even to this day...you can walk in the Smithsonian Institution (Air and Science building) and find a squadron of young ladies desperately fighting for the chance to learn about her. So I truly believe the woman carried some form of cosmetics with her. Yeah, she may have not used these all the time...but in public she was an admiration to many women. Especially the young ladies of our future. As for the flying laboratory...I believe that Putnam had a line of potential companies lined out to compensate the trip. I just don't believe it was one particular item such as freckle cream. There were many others. Anyway, I also found out as of last evening...that Amelia and Fred had just more than items of cosmetics. But, something that fans would enjoy! Looking back at the pictures of her stops...I don't see large quantities of these floating around or in big bags. So this so-called 'flying laboratory" was more than just a flying pharmacy, but may have served as our first air mail service. You be the judge!!!
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Dan Kelly

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Re: Dr. Berry's Freckle Cream
« Reply #427 on: November 14, 2012, 10:52:10 PM »


Heck...even to this day...you can walk in the Smithsonian Institution (Air and Science building) and find a squadron of young ladies desperately fighting for the chance to learn about her. So I truly believe the woman carried some form of cosmetics with her. Yeah, she may have not used these all the time...but in public she was an admiration to many women. Especially the young ladies of our future.

It is amazing isn't it that after all these years she still is an inspiration, and not only as a pilot it seems.
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C.W. Herndon

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Re: Dr. Berry's Freckle Cream
« Reply #428 on: November 16, 2012, 02:21:27 PM »

Joe you know as well as anyone how a word or two changed from a quote makes a big difference in meaning in the whole.You state that in preparation for her 1928 flight, Amelia Said she typically packed a tube of cold cream for cracked lips as part of her "irreducible minimum" of cosmetics." You, quoting Earharts letter.
That is not what the letter states. In fact she never mentioned the word COSMETICS at all. She said she was carrying an irreducible minimum of TOILETRIES.

In fact the letter states she did not worry about appearance on the flight, "the men do not", she said. Nothing was ever mentioned about one single cosmetic. Cracked lips can cause infections and discomfort, a toothbrush is to avoid tooth and gum infections and decay, and a comb is necessary to keep hair out of her eyes. Tissue to wipe away fluids no doubt. That was her "irreducible minimum of Toiletries"

So yes, she was a woman. She cared about her skin. She also inferred she wasn't worried about it during the fllight record you referenced. Maybe she did an about face, and brought a full makeup kit on her last flight. On her 1928 trip, she was clear there was no cosmetics.

Tom, you have a habit, at least lately here on the Forum, of making a big deal out of how a word or two change in a quote can make a big difference in the meaning of a statement, and then you do the same thing yourself. I have high-lighted portions of your statements above to show you this. Here is a link to the portion of the Earhart Letter, personal preparations for the 1928 Flight, that you say you are quoting. Twice you use the quotation "irreducible minimum of toiletries". Nowhere does she say that. What she says is "Toilet articles boiled down to a pretty irreducible minimum", not exactly the same but rather your interptation of what she said. She also said nothing about any"tissue" but rather said "The only 'extras' were some fresh handerchiefs (sic)...." not the same at all. Nowhere do I see where she says that the toothpaste and comb were the only items that she took. She said that they were there and IMHO anything more or less than that is someone else's opinion.

She also said "My 'vanity case' was a very small army knapsack.". Here is a link to photos of Army knapsacks. Which one do you think might be representative of the "small" one she said she carried?

Also please note that the 1928 flight was accross the Atlantic and only measured in hours, whereas the 1937 around the world flight was measured in weeks and with stops in many places where AE could not be assured of being able to obtain articles she might require. This IMHO, might mean that she carried a larger supply of both toilet articles and cosmetics on this longer flight.

If you are going to be critical of what others say, at least please try to have your own information correct.
Woody (former 3316R)
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tom howard

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Re: Dr. Berry's Freckle Cream
« Reply #429 on: November 16, 2012, 10:19:26 PM »

Joe you know as well as anyone how a word or two changed from a quote makes a big difference in meaning in the whole.You state that in preparation for her 1928 flight, Amelia Said she typically packed a tube of cold cream for cracked lips as part of her "irreducible minimum" of cosmetics." You, quoting Earharts letter.
That is not what the letter states. In fact she never mentioned the word COSMETICS at all. She said she was carrying an irreducible minimum of TOILETRIES.

In fact the letter states she did not worry about appearance on the flight, "the men do not", she said. Nothing was ever mentioned about one single cosmetic. Cracked lips can cause infections and discomfort, a toothbrush is to avoid tooth and gum infections and decay, and a comb is necessary to keep hair out of her eyes. Tissue to wipe away fluids no doubt. That was her "irreducible minimum of Toiletries"

So yes, she was a woman. She cared about her skin. She also inferred she wasn't worried about it during the fllight record you referenced. Maybe she did an about face, and brought a full makeup kit on her last flight. On her 1928 trip, she was clear there was no cosmetics.

If you are going to be critical of what others say, at least please try to have your own information correct.
Yes, you're right and I expect the same applies to all posters, including those that reply to me.

The main point of my post, and one easily understood, was simply that Joe had changed an important word in a quotation, one that IMO does not carry the same meaning, toiletries vs. cosmetics.  Joe has explained for himself that he disagrees about the importance of changing the quotation, so it is up to the forum to decide for themselves.

.

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JNev

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Re: Dr. Berry's Freckle Cream
« Reply #430 on: November 17, 2012, 04:27:55 AM »

Jeff N wrote
Quote
I have to confess that I really respect Dr. Tom King's summary view of what was found there regarding context, etc. and the possibilities (in his publications - wisely not posted in this forum by his august hand - which I well understand now)

Jeff is these on his blog or other places? Links please :)

Of course, Chris - I'm sorry, I should have done that -

Please have a look at Dr. King's "Amelia Earhart Archeology", and an installment on "Why I Don’t Think We’ll Find the Airplane – And Why I Don’t Think It Matters" by Tom King.  This example is from back on December 8, 2010 and he has other work that you can find through this source, some later no doubt.

I've also read some of his books and find his work very interesting and well worthwhile.

Enjoy.
- Jeff Neville

Former Member 3074R
 
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Joe Cerniglia

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Re: Dr. Berry's Freckle Cream
« Reply #431 on: November 17, 2012, 05:23:46 AM »

Here is the quotation I am alleged to have altered for purposes of deception:

"Earhart's description of preparations for the 1928 flight, wherein she said she typically packed a tube of cold cream for 'cracked lips' as part of her 'irreducible minimum' of cosmetics."

Notice the double quotes.  Those represent my words.  Notice the single quotes. Those are Earhart's words.  Because I used the word cosmetics, and Earhart used the word toiletries, I am said to have twisted Earhart's words.  I cited evidence for you that cosmetics and toiletries are often said to be synonymous.  In either case, I had no intention of misleading or deceiving anyone. 

Altering or fabricating quotations is a serious charge in academic disciplines.  They are serious charges even in an informal forum such as this one.  Many an author's career has been left in ruins over such charges when they are part of a pervasive and true pattern.  Jonah Lehrer of the New Yorker is only one example.

I will always be civil here, but I will defend myself from scurrilous and baseless charges.

The main point of the quotation above, lost in the debate over integrity, is that Earhart claimed to have cold cream as part of an "irreducible minimum" for flight preparation.  An artifact, maybe two, was recovered at the Seven Site that could well fit that description.  This is not proof of any such thing, but my purpose in answering Jeff Carter's question was to bring to light incidents in which Earhart was known to have been conscious about her skin and/or appearance.  I have been researching and collecting these over a two-year period in which I have scoured libraries and other sources. The other examples I supplied in support of this were largely ignored, distorting my point entirely.

You will never find me knowingly distorting evidence.  Whenever evidence has been proven to controvert that which I earlier believed to be true, I embraced it.

My defense is not incivility. It is the reasonable effort that all reasonable people make to defend their own work.

Joe Cerniglia
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Joe Cerniglia

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Re: Dr. Berry's Freckle Cream
« Reply #432 on: November 17, 2012, 08:41:50 AM »

Point taken, Jeff, and very good advice you give.  I've taken no lasting offense, and will not try to return any.  I hold to the opinions I expressed.  My guiding principle is to speak when I have something to say but also let the discussion continue.  Differences can usually be resolved when people keep talking, are firm when needed, but mostly flexible. That is the advice I will offer myself today.

Regarding the cosmetics, I would say we're observing a bit of a paradox.  Earhart was uncomfortable with her appearance, as documented in 2 accounts.  One might assume she didn't want to talk about it all that often.  The few times she did talk about it were noticed by those around her and documented.  We will probably never find Earhart saying with exact specificity what, if anything, she packed in the way of cosmetics, but it may be reasonable to assume, and others before me have assumed, she did pack them.  The best evidence we have obtained I can see that she brought cosmetics on the world flight was contained in Dr. King's article on the compact I cited earlier in the thread, wherein it is described Rick Jones unearthed a photo of Earhart with what looks to be a box-like compact in her hand as she deplaned from the Electra in Australia. 

Joe Cerniglia
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Randy Conrad

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Re: Dr. Berry's Freckle Cream
« Reply #433 on: November 18, 2012, 07:56:56 PM »

Joe...Several days ago you and I talked for several minutes in regard to the document that I found in the pharmecutical journal that indicated that W.B. Forsyth created Dr. Berry's Freckle Ointment! At that time, I thought that Forsyth just used Dr. Berry name for a label. Anyway, last night I went further back into the Chicago Tribune from 1906, and found out that indeed there was a Dr. Berry. According to this newspaper clip, it indicates that Dr. Berry was a renowned skin doctor in his time, and that he must had alot of notoriety by the large bold letters of his name in the paper. What caught my eye was freckle ointment for sale below the article. This tells me now that there were two different types of freckle ointment made. One by Berry and the other by Forsyth. So, if this is the case, then the jar found on the island must have been made by Dr. Berry and Hazel Atlas. Enjoy the article!
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Joe Cerniglia

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Re: Dr. Berry's Freckle Cream
« Reply #434 on: November 20, 2012, 05:32:22 AM »

Superb work, Randy!  We had much research on the president of Berry Chemical, William Bond Forsyth(e), researched and described by Greg George as "a charlatan and quack-medicine purveyor involved in numerous schemes."  But we had never had reason to believe Dr. C.H. Berry was a real individual involved (at least originally) in selling his own branded freckle ointment.

Incidentally, just by coincidence, AE graduated from Hyde Park High School in 1916 while living in Chicago. Hyde Park is 7.3 miles from Dr. Berry's offices as listed in 1893.  The C.H. Berry Co. headquarters was later opened at 2975 Michigan Avenue, only a 4.6-mile walk from Hyde Park.

I do not take any of this to be more than a coincidence.  It wouldn't establish anything of substance; it's just curious.

Anyway, terrific work!  The forum is turning out to be a great source of research both to verify and to disverify, and I consider both to be extremely important activities!

Incidentally, I have decided to test the bottle of Skat for comparison to the existing spectra of artifact 2-8-s-2a.  I've already set that process in motion by reaching out to obtain the spectral files from earlier this year. 

Joe Cerniglia
TIGHAR #3078 ECR
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