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Bryan Mitchell miller

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Discovery Channel show
« on: December 12, 2010, 10:24:15 AM »

My name is Bryan, I'm 44, and never gave Amelia Earhart a second thought. I saw the show on her last night on The Discovery Channel and was completely amazed. I was so amazed that one of the first things I did when I woke up this morning (after my coffee) was locate the tighar website, poke around there for a while, find the forum section, register, wait for the confirmation email, and login just to share how good that show was.
One thing about the show that got to me was the fact that Amelia probably did not die in a split second from a crash like I would have believed. It looks like she landed, Fred Noonan was badly injured, probably from when the tire hit the hole in the reef (nessi). So she probably out lived Fred and she probably saw the Navy search planes. She had to deal with thousands of large land crabs constantly. Especially after seeing what they did to the pig on last nights show.
After absorbing last night's show and sleeping on it, I came up with a question for Ric:
What if the plane is not in the water? What if the plane's wheel was ripped of during the landing and then slid onto the beach?
I don't know how fast a plane is going when it lands, but it seems to me that it could have landed, hit the hole, lost the wheel, and kept on sliding forward. That could also explain Noonan's injuries and the fact that you found airplane parts on land.
On the show it was said that crashing waves could have ripped the plane from it's wheel.
I think the plane could have come in for a landing, hit the hole, lost the wheel, and slid up on the beach, where it was picked apart.
On the show the "jungle" looked VERY thick and this crash happened over 70 years ago. Imagine how much growth must have taken place in 70 years. You could be standing 20 feet from the plane and not even know it.
Anyway I guess I've gone on enough.
I would like for Ric to know that the show was really something else. I'm a 44 year old former construction worker with a tenth grade education. I never could have cared less About Amelia before watching the show, now I just want to watch it again.
Good luck in 2012, and good luck in bringing closure to this case.
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Ric Gillespie

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Re: Discovery Channel show
« Reply #1 on: December 12, 2010, 12:03:27 PM »

What if the plane is not in the water? What if the plane's wheel was ripped of during the landing and then slid onto the beach?
I don't know how fast a plane is going when it lands, but it seems to me that it could have landed, hit the hole, lost the wheel, and kept on sliding forward. That could also explain Noonan's injuries and the fact that you found airplane parts on land.
On the show it was said that crashing waves could have ripped the plane from it's wheel.
I think the plane could have come in for a landing, hit the hole, lost the wheel, and slid up on the beach, where it was picked apart.

Thanks Bryan. Fair question - but if the plane had ended up on the beach or back in the dense vegetation it should have been found when that whole area was cleared and planted by the colonists in 1949.  Also, in order for the plane to send post-loss radio distress it had to be able to run the right-hand engine to recharge the battery.  It's hard to imagine how that would be possible in the scenario you describe.
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Tom Swearengen

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Re: Discovery Channel show
« Reply #2 on: December 12, 2010, 12:22:06 PM »

Actually, Brian has a point. If the left main was ripped off on landing, the starboard prop "might" have been elevated enough to clear, so running the engine might also have been a possibility. Either way, you havent found parts of the Electra.
Tom Swearengen TIGHAR # 3297
 
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Ric Gillespie

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Re: Discovery Channel show
« Reply #3 on: December 12, 2010, 12:58:04 PM »

Actually, Brian has a point. If the left main was ripped off on landing, the starboard prop "might" have been elevated enough to clear, so running the engine might also have been a possibility.

That's true, but the landing could only have been made where the reef is smooth enough and that's out near the ocean edge.  Between there and the beach are more than 600 feet of jagged and pitted coral.  There's just no way the plane could get to the beach intact enough to run an engine.

Either way, you havent found parts of the Electra.

Maybe, maybe not.  We've found airplane parts in the abandoned village that are consistent with Earhart's Electra and do not seem to match any WWII aircraft.  No part numbers or serial numbers though, so it's still speculation.
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Tom Swearengen

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Re: Discovery Channel show
« Reply #4 on: December 12, 2010, 01:18:01 PM »

I agree that the Electra didnt make it to the beach. You have been there, so you know the reef and the island much better than us. The rest of us can only give well intended theories. Gee --it's the well intended theories that have gotten TIGHAR into this 20+ year adventure! Ric, you have lead the TIGHAR team to go and do, so it is my hope that you will continue to go and do, until a final answer is written.
Tom
Tom Swearengen TIGHAR # 3297
 
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Martin X. Moleski, SJ

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Re: Discovery Channel show
« Reply #5 on: December 12, 2010, 07:03:11 PM »

I watched the show from a poker table when it was on live, then watched it on DVR after the game was over.

My first impression is that it was a most excellent narrative of AE's career, the history of TIGHAR, and, of course, the 2010 expedition (Niku VI).  I'll have to watch it again to pick up just a few fine points where I found myself saying, "Oh, I wish they hadn't said it that way." 

I'm an Ameliaholic.  The term has not yet entered the medical literature, but it means that I don't see things the way other people do.  I'm strangely insane when it comes to Ameliana.  For me, it was a program well worth watching and I look forward to the replay.  I don't know that normies would find it as entertaining as I did.  The two hours are packed with information about AE and TIGHAR--a heady liqueur for me and my homies, but perhaps not for others.

The production values were first-rate.  The vintage photos and movies were beautifully rendered.  If there was music, I didn't get to pay much attention to it.  I hope our overseas supporters do get a chance to see it, but I could understand if the European programmers decided to give it a miss.  It might not sell well away from the States.
LTM,

           Marty
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Don Dollinger

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Re: Discovery Channel show
« Reply #6 on: December 13, 2010, 10:20:35 AM »

Quote
My first impression is that it was a most excellent narrative of AE's career, the history of TIGHAR, and, of course, the 2010 expedition (Niku VI). 

I wholeheartedly agree.  It was a welcomed surprise that they didn't spend alot of time on the other theories other then the possibility of her crashing in the ocean.  The explanation of the post loss messages to explain away that aspect was also well done and very convincing.   The segment about the hole on the reef led me too believe that it very well could've been a catalyst of a short stop and violent impact of FN against something within the interior of the plane.  I'm wondering if FN ever even made it to shore, from the sounds of it his head injury was no small matter or at least he was not dealing it with very well.  Emily talking about the body/bones on the reef near nessy could very well have been that of FN. 

Hope you did well on the Poker table (another one of my loves), I made sure I was done playing (on-line, and frankly was up quite substantially when I bowed out) and had no distractions what-so-ever when I watched.  Glad I did as I gleaned a few more little tidbits that could not have been conveyed to me as well in writing.  My compliments too Ric, crew, and the Discovery Channel. 

LTM

Don
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Martin X. Moleski, SJ

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Re: Discovery Channel show
« Reply #7 on: December 13, 2010, 07:30:23 PM »

Hope you did well on the Poker table (another one of my loves), I made sure I was done playing (on-line, and frankly was up quite substantially when I bowed out) and had no distractions what-so-ever when I watched. 

We were playing six-handed "tournaments" for nothing more than bragging rights.

I won three and lost four.  But it was a 22-to-1 shot that took me out in the seventh tournament.
I'm relatively happy with my betting on that hand.  "Live by the river, die by the river."

I do have to remember that folks who play (as I do) just for the fun of it are motivated
to be calling stations.  If enough people call down on ridiculous draws, a number of
ridiculous things happen.

Quote
My compliments too Ric, crew, and the Discovery Channel. 

Hear, hear!
LTM,

           Marty
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Don Dollinger

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Re: Discovery Channel show
« Reply #8 on: December 14, 2010, 10:32:30 AM »

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But it was a 22-to-1 shot that took me out in the seventh tournament.

Been there, done that, got the T-shirt.  Anyone who has spent any amount of time playing the game has their bad beat stories, as they say "that's poker".  As long as you are happy with the way you played the hand then you probably played it correctly and in the long run, statiscally,  it will pay dividends.  If you won 3 of 7 of a six handed game, you are definately a player and I definately would be honored to sit across a table and match wits with you anyday.  Who knows, it may happen, I have a sister who lives in Catteraugus and works in Buffalo.  I get down that way usually at least once a year.

Playing poker is sorta like the search for Amelia, you keep changing your strategy as the situation (clues) dicatates until you find what works.  You take the small wins (circumstantial evidence) and realize that as long as keep you keep your focus on the final prize (smoking gun), eventually you will walk away with the pot of gold (mystery solved)...

LTM

Don
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Martin X. Moleski, SJ

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Re: Discovery Channel show
« Reply #9 on: December 14, 2010, 06:46:59 PM »

Quote
But it was a 22-to-1 shot that took me out in the seventh tournament.

Been there, done that, got the T-shirt.  Anyone who has spent any amount of time playing the game has their bad beat stories, as they say "that's poker".  As long as you are happy with the way you played the hand then you probably played it correctly and in the long run, statistically,  it will pay dividends.  If you won 3 of 7 of a six handed game, you are definitely a player and I definitely would be honored to sit across a table and match wits with you any day.  Who knows, it may happen, I have a sister who lives in Cattaraugus and works in Buffalo.  I get down that way usually at least once a year.

My family has a camp (a.k.a. "the farm") near Little Valley, just a few hills away from Cattaraugus.  Keep me posted on your travel plans!

Quote
Playing poker is sorta like the search for Amelia, you keep changing your strategy as the situation (clues) dicatates until you find what works.  You take the small wins (circumstantial evidence) and realize that as long as keep you keep your focus on the final prize (smoking gun), eventually you will walk away with the pot of gold (mystery solved)...

Playing Ameliana also depends on many calculations of probability--and coping with lots of unknowns along the way.  “The race is not always to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, but that's the way to bet” (Damon Runyon).
LTM,

           Marty
           TIGHAR #2359A
 
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Mike Piner

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Re: Discovery Channel show
« Reply #10 on: December 14, 2010, 08:00:09 PM »

Marty:
I find it hard to initiate a post on the forum I cannot find the right item to click on.  The help has a really lot to look at and read, but it does not give adequate directions of where to go to start.  I admit i am rather dense, but you're not here to say Dummie do this. any suggestions    -Mike Piner  Ps I know this is not on topic, but neither is poker  LTM
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James G. Stoveken

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Re: Discovery Channel show
« Reply #11 on: December 14, 2010, 09:13:46 PM »

I think I can help out here Mike, if what you mean by "initiate a post" is starting a new thread or "new topic".  Once you're logged in it's basically just two steps.  First, decide what area of the forum would be best for your particular subject and click on it.  For example, if I wasn't replying directly to your post in this thread, these instructions would be better located in the "Forum FAQs and problem solving" area.  Once you've opened up the area you chose, look for four tabs... MARK READ/NOTIFY/NEW TOPIC/POST NEW POLL
On my monitor these tabs are located on the right half of the screen, a little more than halfway down.  Click on the NEW TOPIC tab, and you should be good to go.
Jim Stoveken
 
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Martin X. Moleski, SJ

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Re: Discovery Channel show
« Reply #12 on: December 14, 2010, 09:20:46 PM »

I think I can help out here Mike, if what you mean by "initiate a post" is starting a new thread or "new topic".  Once you're logged in it's basically just two steps.  First, decide what area of the forum would be best for your particular subject and click on it.  For example, if I wasn't replying directly to your post in this thread, these instructions would be better located in the "Forum FAQs and problem solving" area.  Once you've opened up the area you chose, look for four tabs... MARK READ/NOTIFY/NEW TOPIC/POST NEW POLL
On my monitor these tabs are located on the right half of the screen, a little more than halfway down.  Click on the NEW TOPIC tab, and you should be good to go.

Thanks for pitching in with a very helpful post, James.  I'll copy it to the "Forum FAQs and problem solving for future reference and further development.  FWIW, there is also a "Help" button in the upper-left-hand corner of the page (a small tab).  

Edit #1: Hmm, there is already an article on "How to post to the Forum" with beautiful screen captures showing all of the relevant buttons to start a new topic or to reply to one already underway.  Is there some way to improve that article?  Improve the images?  Inquiring minds want to know.

Edit #2: Looking more closely at the extant article on "How to post to the Forum", I see that there is also a video tutorial showing how to post to the Forum in case folks happen to be visual learners.

I really think that the screen captures and the video cover the three basic ways to make a post:

  • Start a new topic (which I call a "thread" in the video--my bad!).
  • Reply to an existing post without quoting.
  • Reply to an existing post with quoting.
LTM,

           Marty
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« Last Edit: December 14, 2010, 09:38:29 PM by moleski »
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James G. Stoveken

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Re: Discovery Channel show
« Reply #13 on: December 15, 2010, 08:00:24 AM »

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Is there some way to improve that article?  Improve the images?  Inquiring minds want to know.

The article and graphics are great Marty.  Although I haven't looked at it, I'm sure the video is too.  What's not so great is my memory, for if it were I'd have just provided a link to them.   :-[
Jim Stoveken
 
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