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Author Topic: Can you add to the list of sextant numbers?  (Read 197770 times)

Andrew M McKenna

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Re: Can you add to the list of sextant numbers?
« Reply #390 on: February 08, 2017, 04:40:30 PM »

So, I went to the SI NMAH website and surfed about.

Checking in the Departments, I found a link to "email Collections Management Services" which took me to a page where I could submit my email and ask a question.  It tells me that the email will go to Robert Horton who is the Chair of the Archives Center.  Not sure he's the right guy, but I wasn't given a choice.

here is what I posted:

<<<<<<<<<

Greetings. 

I track the sales of Brandis Sextants on the web, and noted recently this eBay sale that ended rather abruptly:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Brandis-amp-Sons-Sextant-/132084187552?ul_noapp=true&nma=true&si=whEmfF3LcXt9%252BK6R7YKZy5k4i1I%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

scroll down to the bottom half of the page.

Tracing that Sextant, I also found that it is currently listed in the collection of the SI NMAH found here:

http://amhistory.si.edu/navigation/object.cfm?recordnumber=1087501

I note that the description given in the eBay listing is identical to the description from the NNAH collections site.

How is it that an object listed in the collections of the NMAH ends up being offered for sale on eBay?  Was it sold as surplus to the public?  Stolen?  What?

I retained a screenshot of the eBay listing and the photos that were posted in the event that you would care to have them.

Looking forward to hearing how and why this sextant got out of the NMAH collection.

Best regards

Andrew McKenna

>>>>>>>>>>>

Will be interesting to see what kind of response I get.

AMCK
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Andrew M McKenna

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Re: Can you add to the list of sextant numbers?
« Reply #391 on: February 08, 2017, 05:27:47 PM »

Odd, but I found this same Smithsonian sextant on the following site, also related to the NMAH:

http://americanhistory.si.edu/collections/search/object/nmah_1087501

The description includes the serial number 5670 (rather than 5760 found on the other site) along with Navy 4705, but this description also mentions that it is in box number 3946, and also includes a photo of the sextant in the box where the number is visible.  see below.

DESCRIPTION
This sextant was probably made for use in World War I. Brandis termed it a "U.S. Navy surveying sextant, 6 inch radius, reading 30 seconds of arc." New it cost $120. The frame is anodized brass. The silvered scale is graduated every 10 minutes from -5° to +182° and read by vernier with tangent screw and magnifier. The inscriptions read "BRANDIS & SONS, BROOKLYN, N.Y." and "5670." The words "U.S. Navy-N-4705" are scratched onto the arc. The serial number inside the wooden box is 3946.
Ref: Brandis & Sons Mfg. Co., Catalogue No. 20. Instruments of Precision (Brooklyn, n.d.), p. 298.

Unfortunately, the photo is not of high enough resolution to see the serial number, so it is hard to tell whether the actual serial is 5670 or 5760.  My guess is that 5670 is a typo.

Can anyone find a copy of this publication?

Brandis & Sons Mfg. Co., Catalogue No. 20. Instruments of Precision (Brooklyn, n.d.)

AMCK

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Andrew M McKenna

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Re: Can you add to the list of sextant numbers?
« Reply #392 on: February 09, 2017, 09:26:37 AM »

Here is a reply from Robert Horton of the Smithsonian:

"Thank you for contacting us about this. I’ll forward your message to the Division of Medicine and Science, which holds the sextant in its collection and can answer your question; a curator will respond to you directly."

AMCK
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Andrew M McKenna

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Re: Can you add to the list of sextant numbers?
« Reply #393 on: February 09, 2017, 12:06:04 PM »

And the reply from the Curator:

Mr. McKenna:
 
Immediately upon receiving your recent email, we looked on the shelf in our Reference Room and found our Brandis sextant right where it belongs. Thanks so much for bringing this matter to our attention.
 
Deborah Jean Warner
Curator, Physical Sciences Collection
National Museum of American History
Smithsonian Institution
Washington, D.C. 20013-7012

>>>>>>>>

So, I guess the eBay listing was some sort of bogus posting.  Go figure.

amck
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Martin X. Moleski, SJ

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Re: Can you add to the list of sextant numbers?
« Reply #394 on: February 09, 2017, 02:48:50 PM »

So, I guess the eBay listing was some sort of bogus posting.  Go figure.

OK.

5760 or 5670?

LTM,

           Marty
           TIGHAR #2359A
 
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Matt Revington

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Re: Can you add to the list of sextant numbers?
« Reply #396 on: February 14, 2017, 01:15:21 PM »

I have been requested by the author of this blog, The Ghost of Gardner Island,  to post a link to it

gardnerghost.blogspot.com/2016/11/a-brandis-sextant-taxonomy-surveying.html

It contains (among other things) some discussions of  Brandis sextants that are relevant to this thread.



Edited by MXM to make the link work.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2017, 01:32:44 PM by Martin X. Moleski, SJ »
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Andrew M McKenna

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Re: Can you add to the list of sextant numbers?
« Reply #397 on: February 14, 2017, 03:23:49 PM »

The plot thickens

Marty asks "5760 or 5670?"

Sextant 5760 listed on the Smithsonian site
http://amhistory.si.edu/navigation/object.cfm?recordnumber=1087501

Vs number 5670, as indicated on this site:
http://americanhistory.si.edu/collections/search/object/nmah_1087501


I asked Deb Warner of the Physical Sciences Collection if she could verify the actual serial number, and here is her reply:

<<<<<<<<<<<<
Andrew:
 
I just looked again at the Brandis sextant. The correct s/n is 5670. I would like to correct listing on the NMAH collections site, but the technology behind that site is so old that changes are now impossible.
 
Deborah
>>>>>>>>>>>

So it is
Brandis 5670
Navy 4705
in box # 3946
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Andrew M McKenna

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Re: Can you add to the list of sextant numbers?
« Reply #398 on: February 14, 2017, 03:26:31 PM »

I have been requested by the author of this blog, The Ghost of Gardner Island,  to post a link to it

gardnerghost.blogspot.com/2016/11/a-brandis-sextant-taxonomy-surveying.html

It contains (among other things) some discussions of  Brandis sextants that are relevant to this thread.



Edited by MXM to make the link work.

Yes, for those interested in all things Brandis, this site has a lot of good information about the different variants and some reasonable thoughts on dates of manufacture that might help guide us to understanding what type of Brandis may have been found on Nikumaroro (assuming the serial numbers of the box match the sextant it held).

Andrew
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Bruce Thomas

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Re: Can you add to the list of sextant numbers?
« Reply #399 on: February 14, 2017, 03:52:14 PM »

The plot thickens

Marty asks "5760 or 5670?"

Sextant 5760 listed on the Smithsonian site
http://amhistory.si.edu/navigation/object.cfm?recordnumber=1087501

Vs number 5670, as indicated on this site:
http://americanhistory.si.edu/collections/search/object/nmah_1087501


I asked Deb Warner of the Physical Sciences Collection if she could verify the actual serial number, and here is her reply:

<<<<<<<<<<<<
Andrew:
 
I just looked again at the Brandis sextant. The correct s/n is 5670. I would like to correct listing on the NMAH collections site, but the technology behind that site is so old that changes are now impossible.
 
Deborah
>>>>>>>>>>>

So it is
Brandis 5670
Navy 4705
in box # 3946

I updated the entry in the table within Ameliapedia.
LTM,

Bruce
TIGHAR #3123R
 
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Andrew M McKenna

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Re: Can you add to the list of sextant numbers?
« Reply #400 on: February 22, 2017, 02:11:08 PM »

Different Brandis on eBay

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sextant-Brandis-1941-WWII-Navy-with-case-/322430590749?hash=item4b125c5f1d:g:HkAAAOSw32lYrEi8

Calibration Label indicates
Brandis 3898
Navy 4842

Looks like 3898 on the Box as well.

I asked the seller to confirm the numbers on the instrument match the box.

Added 2/27/17 - Seller confirmed the numbers as follows:

"Yes, I confirm the numbers on the card are the numbers engraved on the instrument
Also - please look at the additional pictures (7) I added to the listing.
Thank you for your interest. vonposen"

AMCK
« Last Edit: February 27, 2017, 10:41:24 AM by Andrew M McKenna »
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Martin X. Moleski, SJ

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Re: Can you add to the list of sextant numbers?
« Reply #401 on: February 22, 2017, 04:27:41 PM »

Calibration Label indicates
Brandis 3898
Navy 4842

Looks like 3898 on the Box as well.

I've updated the table.

I put the inspection date as 1941.  The last digit seems to me to be obscure.  I suppose it could be part of a 4 or a 7.
LTM,

           Marty
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Andrew M McKenna

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Re: Can you add to the list of sextant numbers?
« Reply #402 on: April 18, 2017, 11:14:30 AM »

Couple of Brandis popped up on eBay today.

First looks like Serial 6028 in Box 3850

http://www.ebay.com/itm/122449968517?ul_noapp=true

From the photos, I can't see any USNO number etched on the arc.  I'll ask the seller if there is one.

Interesting that the serial number is in its own little polished "bubble".  I would take that, along with the high serial number, and no USNO number to mean that this unit is a later manufactured instrument compared to most of the sextants we've seen, and probably was never in the Navy inventory.

Andrew
« Last Edit: April 18, 2017, 11:17:03 AM by Andrew M McKenna »
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Andrew M McKenna

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Re: Can you add to the list of sextant numbers?
« Reply #403 on: April 18, 2017, 11:43:05 AM »

The second sextant is listed on eBay, but is also part of a live auction this weekend.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/332184487778?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

From what I can see, it has a Navy number of sorts - 161-USN-25219 - hand etched into the frame rather than the arc.

I can't see a serial number, or any number etched into the arc. 

The box has a stenciled number starting with 57XX, but the last two numbers are illegible in one photo, or cut off in another.

I've sent questions to the seller to see if they can provide further info on numbers.

Andrew
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Andrew M McKenna

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Re: Can you add to the list of sextant numbers?
« Reply #404 on: April 18, 2017, 04:08:29 PM »

Seller of this first sextant says the following

"Hi. Yes, the number is 6028 and the box says 3850. There are no numbers etched on the arc or on the box. It appears that a label may have been removed from the inner lid, but it is no longer with the set. Thanks for your interest."


Couple of Brandis popped up on eBay today.

First looks like Serial 6028 in Box 3850

http://www.ebay.com/itm/122449968517?ul_noapp=true

From the photos, I can't see any USNO number etched on the arc.  I'll ask the seller if there is one.

Interesting that the serial number is in its own little polished "bubble".  I would take that, along with the high serial number, and no USNO number to mean that this unit is a later manufactured instrument compared to most of the sextants we've seen, and probably was never in the Navy inventory.

Andrew
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