TIGHAR
Amelia Earhart Search Forum => News, Views, Books, Archival Data & Interviews on AE => Topic started by: Greg Daspit on July 23, 2014, 03:18:22 PM
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teen pilot dies in Pacific crash (http://news.msn.com/us/spokeswoman-indiana-teen-pilot-dies-in-crash) in round-the-world attempt
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I hadn't heard of this world flight attempt, but it had a sad ending in the Pacific Ocean.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/07/23/haris-suleman-teen-attempting-world-flight-record-killed-in-plane-crash/
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Yes Greg! Saw this. Guess they all don't make it. Sad.
http://myfox8.com/2014/07/23/plane-of-father-son-duo-crashes-during-world-spanning-flight-sons-body-recovered/
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No indication of a primary cause yet but they went into the water a mile from the end of the runway at Pago. It sounds like it almost had to be engine failure (most engine failures occur at the first reduction in power after takeoff). A survivable ditching should have been possible in the A36 unless the sea was rough or unless they tried to turn back for the airport and fell victim to a classic stall/spin.
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No indication of a primary cause yet but they went into the water a mile from the end of the runway at Pago. It sounds like it almost had to be engine failure (most engine failures occur at the first reduction in power after takeoff). A survivable ditching should have been possible in the A36 unless the sea was rough or unless they tried to turn back for the airport and fell victim to a classic stall/spin.
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Very sad, sorry to hear of this loss.
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"Annie Hayat said the plane flown by 17-year-old Haris Suleman went down shortly after leaving Pago Pago in American Samoa Tuesday night."
A nighttime, no-power ditching ... ANY pilot would have a hard time pulling that one off successfully. Catch a wave the wrong way and you instantly nose under, or the plane cartwheels and tears itself to shreds. Murphy's Law is alive and well, unfortunately.
LTM,
Monty Fowler, TIGHAR No. 2189 ECSP
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"Annie Hayat said the plane flown by 17-year-old Haris Suleman went down shortly after leaving Pago Pago in American Samoa Tuesday night."
A nighttime, no-power ditching ... ANY pilot would have a hard time pulling that one off successfully. Catch a wave the wrong way and you instantly nose under, or the plane cartwheels and tears itself to shreds. Murphy's Law is alive and well, unfortunately.
LTM,
Monty Fowler, TIGHAR No. 2189 ECSP
Do we know that it was "no power", or is that merely surmised?
Maybe it was - but I missed that if we do know it. "Controlled Flight Into Terrain" (or water) happens also, for a variety of reasons. Night take-offs with departure over water can be very disorienting, especially for inexperienced pilots.
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Anybody know how much time the father had?
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Father had 1650 hours.
http://www.razoo.com/story/Flying-Round-The-World-For-Education (http://www.razoo.com/story/Flying-Round-The-World-For-Education)
He had almost 450 hours by 2008 when he had to land on interstate after engine failure.
http://flyaroundtheworldin30days.com/?p=11 (http://flyaroundtheworldin30days.com/?p=11)
Father seems to have been source of idea as it was on his bucket list to fly solo around the world.
Very sad case. They had already raised 500k of one million charity goal of flight, among other things.
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He had almost 450 hours by 2008 when he had to land on interstate after engine failure.
I'd want to know more about that engine failure. Engines rarely quit without warning. In investigating accidents due to engine failures I found that many pilots that experienced engine failures had been ignoring signs of a sick engine for some time.
Of course, we don't know that this was an engine failure - but it seems likely.
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More generally, in case anyone interested, flight hours of last two out three pilots to got/getting guiness youngest solo circumnavigation:
450 hours:
http://blog.aopa.org/opinionleaders/2014/06/27/daring-greatly-a-young-aviators-dream-helps-fund-the-dreams-of-others/ (http://blog.aopa.org/opinionleaders/2014/06/27/daring-greatly-a-young-aviators-dream-helps-fund-the-dreams-of-others/)
500 hours:
http://www.kathrynsreport.com/2014/05/limitless-horizons-matt-guthmiller.html (http://www.kathrynsreport.com/2014/05/limitless-horizons-matt-guthmiller.html)
Also, did not realize this myself until getting background on flight awards but, under federal law, you now have to be licensed pilot and medical to even touch controls of plane if you are attempting flight record or aviation feat.
http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2011-title49/html/USCODE-2011-title49-subtitleVII-partA-subpartiii-chap447-sec44724.htm (http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2011-title49/html/USCODE-2011-title49-subtitleVII-partA-subpartiii-chap447-sec44724.htm)
Law passed after tragic 1996 crash:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jessica_Dubroff (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jessica_Dubroff)
On a happier note, anyone who is a certificated pilot (who joins FAI) can get FAI circumnavigation diploma as long as they were aboard the whole flight and were actively engaged in flying the aircraft (eg no PIC requirement for the diploma.)
http://naa.aero/userfiles/files/documents/Downloads/Circumnavigator%20Diploma%202012.pdf (http://naa.aero/userfiles/files/documents/Downloads/Circumnavigator%20Diploma%202012.pdf)
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Some additional information in this article...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/07/24/father-and-son-round-the-world-flight-ends-in-tragedy-in-the-pacific/
The comment about the engine running rough before the trip began and the final takeoff occurring after dark may be contributing factors.
This quote seems odd: "the air traffic controller saw the lights of the plane go down about 23 miles off American Samoa." I wonder if the author meant "2-3 miles."
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A couple of pieces of new information may shed some light on what happened. One of the boy's last tweets was "No fuel in Kiritimati, going from New Caledonia to Pago Pago, then direct Hawaii. That's about 21 hours of flying in two days." and a witness report says the plane was flying low and suddenly just dove into the ocean.
Pago Pago direct Hawaii is over 2,600 miles (2,400 nautical miles). As I recall, that's just about maximum range for the Bonanza as they had it configured, so you know they were extremely heavy coming out of Pago. The witness report that they were flying low may mean they were actually staggering along in ground effect (just as Earhart did after the takeoff at Lae). Night makes it worse. Under those conditions you don't need an engine failure or even an engine hiccup to bring the plane down. You're on the ragged edge. The slightest error and the airplane stalls. Too low to recover. End of story.
No fuel at Kiritimati a big surprise? It's almost impossible to find avgas anywhere in the Central Pacific. Everybody out there uses turbine equipment. Did somebody tell them there was avgas at Kiritimati and they only learned otherwise later? Or did they not check before they planned their route? This was a major screw up. Suddenly instead of two 1,400 mile hops from Samoa to Hawaii you're faced with a 2,600 mile nonstop leg. And you choose to make the over-gross takeoff in the dark?
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I had enough trouble trusting the fuel quality here in the States at some rural airports. And, having been one of those fueling planes on the ramp during my college days, I can see how easy it can be messed up. In fact, we had a rash of crashes in the '70's here in the Atlanta area of planes coming out of PDK and crashing in downtown from contaminated gas. In two cases they put gas in a turboprop. Makes me wonder about water or trash in the fuel. AC engines don't like that very much.
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... In two cases they put gas in a turboprop. Makes me wonder about water or trash in the fuel. AC engines don't like that very much.
It's Turbine Fuel contamination in a Gas Powered Aircraft that Guarantees an engine failure shortly after takeoff. It's happened to the best! Airlines have done it and even the Great Bob Hoover was signing autographs after his Air Show while the Jet Fuel Truck behind him was filling his Gasoline Powered Aero Commander. (Lot's of different Turbine and Gasoline Aircraft models look alike, Cessna even used to put a "Turbo-System" logo on their Turbo-Charged Gasoline Powered models.)
Bob Hoover's extraordinary skills allowed a successful (no injury to his passengers) off-airport emergency 'landing' and he then put his fame to great use in leading a campaign to prevent occurrence of these events and the FAA started requiring special Aircraft fueling ports and Jet Fuel filling nozzles to stop the practice.
Pratt & Whitney allowed use of Gasoline (80-87, 100 octane or 100LL) in my Turbine PT-6A's for up to 4% of the hours on straight gasoline and up to 12% of the time for "one-part gasoline, three parts Jet-A, JP-1 or JP-5"; JP-4 Jet Fuel already contained 10% gasoline and was allowed for 100% of the time. The downside was mainly increased possibility of Vapor Lock, the increase in consumption and a buildup of Lead deposits.
Pilots are responsible for confirming quality and quantity of their fuel prior to flight, but they 'get-in-a-hurry' ::) too often and the outcome can be so tragic.
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Rick's summation seems to tell the main cause of this unfortunate teenager and his dad's loss.
There is a little connection here with Amelia's Tragedy in that it occurred on the correlating leg to Honolulu, but the Suleman's just decided to try and bypass their 'Howland' fuel stop.
Jeff Scott's Link (http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/07/24/father-and-son-round-the-world-flight-ends-in-tragedy-in-the-pacific/) really supplies a lot of insight for this operation, especially all those arrogant posts or 'tweets' from the participants as well as the 60 comments below from the public.
That Law passed after the child's tragic 1996 crash:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jessica_Dubroff
should provide protection for some innocent children, but Babar and Haris Suleman's stunt was legal because the child Haris had his license/medical. We certainly don't need more laws to protect Adults from their own foolishness that does not endanger others.
The Suleman's were even past their time-line to establish their 'record' before their fatal decision of an overloaded take-off in the dark.
I can't imagine trying to claim a 'Record' for a flight that contains another 'qualified' person aboard that is there to provide support for the mission.
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Pilots are responsible for confirming quality and quantity of their fuel prior to flight, but they 'get-in-a-hurry' ::) too often and the outcome can be so tragic.
I wonder, too, if get-home-itis was at play in this case. It certainly was with Amelia and Fred - George Putnam was pushing for a big, splashy Fourth of July homecoming. It's human nature, when the end of any long, difficult endeavor is in sight, to just "get it over with, already." Which can lead to bad judgments. Which can lead to doing dumb things.
LTM, who knows all about bad judgment and experience,
Monty Fowler, TIGHAR No. 2189 ECSP
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George Putnam was pushing for a big, splashy Fourth of July homecoming.
I'm afraid that's another Amelia Myth. There was no media bash planned for AE's arrival. Public interest in the world flight had cooled and Putnam was having trouble drumming up media interest. The best he could come up with was an interview on a popular radio program that aired Monday night, July 5th. He did send a telegram asking AE if she was going to get home on Saturday (the 3rd), Sunday (the 4th) or Monday (the 5th). He didn't know where she was so she sent the telegram to Itasca. She never saw it.