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Author Topic: No Place to Put a Stone  (Read 22055 times)

Martin X. Moleski, SJ

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No Place to Put a Stone
« on: July 08, 2012, 06:29:19 AM »

Another recent publication (2012): No Place to Put a Stone:  An Analysis of Facts Concerning the Disappearance of Amelia Earhart and Fred Noonan.

Sounds like a splashed-and-sank book, based on navigational considerations.
LTM,

           Marty
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Jeff Victor Hayden

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Re: No Place to Put a Stone
« Reply #1 on: July 08, 2012, 06:35:15 AM »

And from the description of the books contents...

Although it does not define precisely were to find Earhart and her aircraft, it does explain why no one has yet found them and where to look. Happy hunting!

Somewhere in the Pacific ocean region?
Why didn't we think of that.
This must be the place
 
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Malcolm McKay

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Re: No Place to Put a Stone
« Reply #2 on: July 08, 2012, 06:38:16 PM »

Another recent publication (2012): No Place to Put a Stone:  An Analysis of Facts Concerning the Disappearance of Amelia Earhart and Fred Noonan.

Sounds like a splashed-and-sank book, based on navigational considerations.

So? Given the alternative hypotheses splashed and sank is just as viable. At least that's better than citing artifacts of unproven provenance.
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Martin X. Moleski, SJ

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Re: No Place to Put a Stone
« Reply #3 on: July 08, 2012, 06:56:31 PM »

Given the alternative hypotheses splashed and sank is just as viable. At least that's better than citing artifacts of unproven provenance.

Ooooh, I sense a development in your thought.

We have gone from the equality of all unproven statements (a.k.a. Malcolm's Razor) to a positive preference for theories that are artifact-free.

I guess I can see the value.  You save a lot of money by using pure speculation.  Actually digging up artifacts and testing them is expensive.
LTM,

           Marty
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Malcolm McKay

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Re: No Place to Put a Stone
« Reply #4 on: July 08, 2012, 07:27:36 PM »


I guess I can see the value.  You save a lot of money by using pure speculation.  Actually digging up artifacts and testing them is expensive.

Marty I'll ignore the sarcasm - it is getting a bit predictable.

It is a pity that none of the artifacts dug up and tested have clear provenance to Earhart or Noonan isn't it.
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Martin X. Moleski, SJ

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Re: No Place to Put a Stone
« Reply #5 on: July 08, 2012, 07:43:37 PM »

Marty I'll ignore the sarcasm - it is getting a bit predictable.

Here we have another example of apophasis.  No one passes over things in silence more masterfully than yourself.  ;D

Quote
It is a pity that none of the artifacts dug up and tested have clear provenance to Earhart or Noonan, isn't it?

I've added a comma and a question mark to your sentence.

It now corresponds to the ordinary rules of English grammar, which are objective and easily applied to words.

Some of the tests have shown that the artifacts are of the proper time period so that they might have been from AE and FN.  That is a valid part of archaeology (digging and dating).

Some of the tests have shown that the artifacts cannot have come from AE and FN (e.g., the knotted cloth).

The metallurgy reports have excluded some items, I believe, but left others as possible candidates. 2-2-V-1 is still in play.

The apparent rouge and mirror pieces are suggestive of a Western woman at the Seven Site.

I'm glad that they are testing the various bones from the campfires.  I value expert opinions when the experts are talking about their area of expertise.  The "putative poop" and the "fickle finger of fate" were also worth testing.

I suppose if you know the outcome of a scientific test in advance, you don't really need to run the test.

If you're trying to determine what you don't know, the tests may be helpful.

I don't share your belief that archaeology without artifacts to examine is superior to archaeology with artifacts.

LTM,

           Marty
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Malcolm McKay

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Re: No Place to Put a Stone
« Reply #6 on: July 08, 2012, 09:30:08 PM »



I've added a comma and a question mark to your sentence.

It now corresponds to the ordinary rules of English grammar, which are objective and easily applied to words.


When bereft of anything to say correct the grammar  ;D
« Last Edit: July 08, 2012, 09:31:42 PM by Malcolm McKay »
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Martin X. Moleski, SJ

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Re: No Place to Put a Stone
« Reply #7 on: July 08, 2012, 10:14:22 PM »

When bereft of anything to say correct the grammar  ;D

I've noticed that you're a little sensitive about people quoting you exactly.

I indicated why I modified your sentence from its original form.  I like objective standards.  They can be most helpful.

After bringing your sentence up to the standards of ordinary English, I then answered your question in some detail.  You passed over that part of my post in perfect silence.  "When you have nothing to say, say nothing."
LTM,

           Marty
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Malcolm McKay

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Re: No Place to Put a Stone
« Reply #8 on: July 08, 2012, 10:43:27 PM »

"When you have nothing to say, say nothing."

Which loosely translates as "correct the grammar" I presume. Cheer up Marty, how about doing an undergrad. course in archaeology then you might understand the problems.
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Jeff Victor Hayden

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Re: No Place to Put a Stone
« Reply #9 on: July 09, 2012, 01:34:16 PM »

That's a good way of comparing the two main scenarios Jeff, I hadn't thought of it like that before. Very clear indeed.
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Malcolm McKay

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Re: No Place to Put a Stone
« Reply #10 on: July 09, 2012, 06:57:58 PM »


So I don't see how "... the alternative hypotheses splashed and sank is just as viable", and really cannot fathom how "that's better than citing artifacts of unproven provenance".

Just my view, of course.

LTM -

Hi Jeff, in answer to the question it basically is if you have two equally unproven hypotheses then in that case one is as good as the other. It then depends on what your financial resources are as to which one you investigate.
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Rafael Krasnodebski

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Re: No Place to Put a Stone
« Reply #11 on: July 21, 2012, 12:03:26 PM »

Has anyone here actually read the "No Place To Put A Stone" book? Marty only commented that it "sounds like a splashed-and-sank book" and off we go dismissing it as precisely that. If we want people to give TIGHAR a fair hearing, shouldn't we have the courteousy to do the same to others before dismissing them out of hand?
Raf
 
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richie conroy

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Re: No Place to Put a Stone
« Reply #12 on: July 21, 2012, 05:40:26 PM »

Has anyone here actually read the "No Place To Put A Stone" book? Marty only commented that it "sounds like a splashed-and-sank book" and off we go dismissing it as precisely that. If we want people to give TIGHAR a fair hearing, shouldn't we have the courteousy to do the same to others before dismissing them out of hand?

Can you name me one person, Who believe's the New Britain or Sapien story that is a member of Tighar ?

My answer is NO because each hypothesis has it's own followers/believer's

Credit to Tighar for even theorizing about other hypothesis's, As you won't find topic's on there website About Tighar , Unless mocking.

Also you have to remember the older members of Tighar "No disrespect intended" have been searching for over 20 odd years, an have heard, read, analyzed all the Earhart related data !!!

If you search through Tighar archives they have probably forgot more than we know today, Because it's new to us but old to them, And with a little searching on website u will find subjects that have been gone through an the reason why they are not viable so to speak

 :) 

   
We are an echo of the past


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Rafael Krasnodebski

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Re: No Place to Put a Stone
« Reply #13 on: July 21, 2012, 06:17:09 PM »

Sir,

Addressing your first point ... "they started it Miss so it's their fault and anyway they're worser than what we are."
And your second point ... er ... it's a new book,
And my point .... you haven't read it, have you?

These are historical hypothesese man, not Rangers v Celtic. Granted, some of them may be as mad as a bucket of frogs, but if you haven't read them, give them the benefit of the doubt until you have. Then, and only then, trash them for all it's worth if you want. 
 ;D
Raf
 
« Last Edit: July 21, 2012, 06:32:59 PM by Rafael Krasnodebski »
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richie conroy

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Re: No Place to Put a Stone
« Reply #14 on: July 21, 2012, 06:49:03 PM »

Good point's Rafael

One of the issues i have a problem with is

The 281 North of Howland was an apparent radio message received unclarified at time, Yet even with radio reports suggesting they were south of howland the navy spent most of the search looking in area of 281 north of howland ?

The south of howland message come in straight after the 281 north message, Yet they insisted on doing through search to north.

The north messages had no more importance than the south one's did, yet the navy give all they could to the north search, a few days, at least.

Yet they spent at most 10 minutes at each island south of howland

the mind boggles  :)
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