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Author Topic: Plane wreck believed to be Earhart's found in Bougainville  (Read 37285 times)

Don Dollinger

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Re: Plane wreck believed to be Earhart's found in Bougainville
« Reply #15 on: March 02, 2011, 10:38:36 AM »

Quote
Now I know Wikipedia isn't the fount of all human knowledge but Wikipedia, sea snakes would suggest that some species can be found in depths of upto 90M.  However it also indicates that most species of sea snake are docial.

Docile, docile...come on your ruining my whole movie plot here.  KILLER SNAKES can not be docile...

Seems awfully large (6 metres), isn't that like around an 18 footer.  Must be a relative of the Loch Ness Monster.  If it is an eel, do they get that large, were talking Anaconda size here... ;D

Seems from the story that they have been working the site for a very long time (years), would seem that they would have been able to at least verify who the damn plane belonged to by now.  My conspiracy theory mode is telling me that they want everyone to believe that it is AE's plane so no one is gonna pop-up and try to put a claim against their "found" lode of gold.

LTM,

Don
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Chris Johnson

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Re: Plane wreck believed to be Earhart's found in Bougainville
« Reply #16 on: March 02, 2011, 12:27:01 PM »

Quote
Now I know Wikipedia isn't the fount of all human knowledge but Wikipedia, sea snakes would suggest that some species can be found in depths of upto 90M.  However it also indicates that most species of sea snake are docial.

Docile, docile...come on your ruining my whole movie plot here.  KILLER SNAKES can not be docile...

Seems awfully large (6 metres), isn't that like around an 18 footer.  Must be a relative of the Loch Ness Monster.  If it is an eel, do they get that large, were talking Anaconda size here... ;D

Seems from the story that they have been working the site for a very long time (years), would seem that they would have been able to at least verify who the damn plane belonged to by now.  My conspiracy theory mode is telling me that they want everyone to believe that it is AE's plane so no one is gonna pop-up and try to put a claim against their "found" lode of gold.

LTM,

Don

Maybe its dosn't like divers or is a loyal Papuan?
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Walter Runck

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Re: Plane wreck believed to be Earhart's found in Bougainville
« Reply #17 on: March 02, 2011, 05:49:56 PM »

Read the full article in PACNEWS--Pacific Islands News Association.

"The discovery of an aircraft wreck at the depth of 70 metres north-west of Buka in Bougainville may hold some answers to the 74-year mystery of the disappearance of world-famous aviatrix – Amelia Earhart.


This is obviously not N16020.  In the 1930's Lockheed was building aircraft to the US system of units and this one is apparently metric.
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Andrew M McKenna

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Re: Plane wreck believed to be Earhart's found in Bougainville
« Reply #18 on: March 02, 2011, 08:09:57 PM »

this is all hooey.  I think that whoever is orchestrating the PR is intent on getting someone to pay big bucks for the right to recover the aircraft and it's "valuables" along with the "gold bullion", which in the end won't be there.  There is no reason that AE would be carrying gold, it simply weighed too much and they needed the fuel more than gold.  This is going to turn out to be a wartime wreck, they - whoever they are - are just trying to capitalize on the situation either through greed or ignorance.

amck
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Dan Swift

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Re: Plane wreck believed to be Earhart's found in Bougainville
« Reply #19 on: March 02, 2011, 08:13:53 PM »

Serously, forget all that.  Can't be AE's plane as it was close to Howland the following morning.  NO ONE can dispute that fact.   Radio evidence.  End of story! 
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Don Dollinger

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Re: Plane wreck believed to be Earhart's found in Bougainville
« Reply #20 on: March 04, 2011, 12:17:24 PM »

Quote
I think that whoever is orchestrating the PR is intent on getting someone to pay big bucks for the right to recover the aircraft and it's "valuables" along with the "gold bullion", which in the end won't be there. 

I thought Cletus and company were recovering it?

LTM,

Don
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Martin X. Moleski, SJ

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Re: Plane wreck believed to be Earhart's found in Bougainville
« Reply #21 on: March 05, 2011, 07:06:14 AM »

From Art Rypinski, a member of the Earhart Project Advisory Committee (EPAC):

At some point I discovered that there was an airfield on Bougainville, right underneath AE’ track to Howland.  Gasmata was built by the Australians circa 1940, captured by the Japanese in 1942, and used as a satellite strip for Rabaul.   Anyway, the RAAF repeatedly bombed Gasmata using Lockheed Hudsons (Super Electra) flying out of Port Moresby.  Here is a description (with photos) of one Hudson wreck right on AE’s flight path.  Possibly the origin of the Bougainville stories?

http://www.pacificwrecks.com/aircraft/hudson/A16-91.html

This database indicates a Lockheed PV-1 Ventura, s/n 440203 (aka militarized L-14 Super Electra) was lost in the Buka passage!   No details or aircrew names, which may indicate the aircrew survived.

http://www.aviationarchaeology.com/src/USN/PV.htm

In any case, the neighborhood was thick with twin engine, twin tail Lockheed products during WWII.


Russ Matthews, also a member of the Earhart Project Advisory Committee (EPAC), then corrected Art's report:

Ooops .. that's a date, not a serial number.  It should read a US Navy PV-1 Ventura (unknown Bu No) lost in Buka Passage on February 3rd, 1944.

I found the reference in a handy online database at Craig Fuller's Aviation Archaeology website ...

http://www.aviationarchaeology.com/src/USN/PV.htm

A little more info is included in an entry on Justin Taylin's excellent "Pacific Wrecks" reference site (http://www.pacificwrecks.org).  He states that it was a US Marine Corps aircraft (Bu No 33254) based out of Piva Airfield and lost "20 miles off the Buka Passage" (which seems a loooong way out for SCUBA divers).  Curiously, he also lists the plane as belonging to VMF-215 .. a Marine Fighting squadron which so far as I can tell) was never equipped with the PV-1. Maybe it's a typo.


LTM,

           Marty
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« Last Edit: March 05, 2011, 04:39:08 PM by moleski »
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Bruce Thomas

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Re: Plane wreck believed to be Earhart's found in Bougainville
« Reply #22 on: March 05, 2011, 12:50:04 PM »

From Art Rypinski, a member of the Earhart Project Advisory Committee (EPAC):

A little more info is included in an entry on Justin Taylin's excellent "Pacific Wrecks" reference site (http://www.pacificwrecks.org).  He states that it was a US Marine Corps aircraft (Bu No 33254) based out of Piva Airfield and lost "20 miles off the Buka Passage" (which seems a loooong way out for SCUBA divers).  Curiously, he also lists the plane as belonging to VMF-215 .. a Marine Fighting squadron which so far as I can tell) was never equipped with the PV-1. Maybe it's a typo.

I second the idea of a typo.  The Pacific Wrecks website also shows that at the same Piva airfield during that period there was another Marine Corps squadron, VMF(N)-531 "The Grey Ghosts", and it was equipped with PV-1 (Ventura) aircraft.  Typo? ... 215 versus 531 ... you be the judge.
LTM,

Bruce
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Tom Swearengen

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Re: Plane wreck believed to be Earhart's found in Bougainville
« Reply #23 on: March 05, 2011, 02:29:05 PM »

This cant be AE's Electra. It's off the reef at Nikumarro.
Tom Swearengen TIGHAR # 3297
 
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Don Dollinger

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Re: Plane wreck believed to be Earhart's found in Bougainville
« Reply #24 on: March 07, 2011, 08:37:32 AM »

I can believe that its a Marine Aircraft BUT why would a military aircraft be hauling a lode of gold in the Pacific?  If they were hauling a lode of gold they definately would not be on a bombing mission with it.  Looking more and more like Andrew stated that there is no gold.

LTM,

Don
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Martin X. Moleski, SJ

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Re: Plane wreck believed to be Earhart's found in Bougainville
« Reply #25 on: March 08, 2011, 05:49:17 AM »

I received an e-mail today from ACZ that expands the list of possible types of aircraft that might be found in the Bougainville area:

I have been following the "Earhart Discovery" off Buka Island with great interest for the past few days. Obviously it is not the Electra, but, with Matsungan island being about 8 miles northwest of Buka Airfield, I think it's a probability that this is an MIA combat loss.

I believe that TIGHAR's Navy PV-1 suspect is a good possibility, although the location relative to the straits would be overestimated. Let me add a couple more, beyond a forgotten RAAF Hudson or RNZAF Ventura.

Refer to http://PacificWrecks.com account of "The Alpine Milkman," which was a B-25D with S/N 41-30566. 

This B-25 gunship was lost (as in 'vanished') on the night of January 13/14 1944 flying from an island airfield (Stirling) off the south end of Bougainville tasked with the mission of navigating up the west side of Bougainville/Buka to bomb Lakunai airfield near Rabaul. This Mitchell of the 70th Bomb Squadron/42nd Bomb Group was never seen or heard of again after takeoff. Even the Missing Air Crew Report was lost in 1948!

A further clue is reported in the account regarding the radar station at Torokina (west central coast of Bougainville, and south of Buka) 'painting' a distress IFF target "from a position toward Rabaul."

I am theorizing that the PNG divers are probably making their identification by twin engines and twin tails. A B-25 wreck, in heavily encrusted poor condition could possibly qualify as an Electra for them perhaps?

Of course, the above possibilities do not feature gold bullion as cargo. Let me suggest one more possibility that might, and would involve long lost bones too.

The Japanese operated a copy of the Lockheed Super Electra as a transport in significant numbers called the Kawasaki Ki 56. This would add another candidate to a Lockheed Hudson type wreck, and there would probably be no accounting for it today except as a kill for an allied pilot, and possibly in the last days of the Japanese occupation of New Guinea. Perhaps these JAAF pilots might have been trying to evacuate the AO including some bullion in the back?
LTM,

           Marty
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« Last Edit: March 09, 2011, 05:10:13 AM by moleski »
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Martin X. Moleski, SJ

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Re: Plane wreck believed to be Earhart's found in Bougainville
« Reply #26 on: March 09, 2011, 05:05:29 AM »

More information from ACZ:

Thanks for posting my blurb on the forum.
You will want to edit the link for the B-25 to this one:

http://www.pacificwrecks.com/aircraft/b-25/41-30566.html

And here is another obscure detail about this aircraft. This bureau
number IS associated with The Alpine Milkman nose art, but
pacificwrecks has two different accounts for the airplane!

Anyway, read the page above and my interest will make much more sense.

Also, check out the mission map I made for this incident.

Of  course, another possibility is that it was just a couple of blokes flying some
gold out in a twin Beech in the 50's, and they ran out of gas, or something less exotic!
LTM,

           Marty
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Martin X. Moleski, SJ

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Re: Plane wreck believed to be Earhart's found in Bougainville
« Reply #27 on: March 09, 2011, 01:26:43 PM »

Ric has a new Research Bulletin up: "Too True to Believe."
LTM,

           Marty
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Chris Johnson

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Re: Plane wreck believed to be Earhart's found in Bougainville
« Reply #28 on: March 09, 2011, 02:02:23 PM »

Ric has a new Research Bulletin up: "Too True to Believe."

Quote Ric "we'd love to see the eel"

Its better than Python (no pun intended)  :D
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Brad Beeching

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Re: Plane wreck believed to be Earhart's found in Bougainville
« Reply #29 on: March 09, 2011, 02:09:39 PM »

 ;D I know! The gold bullion that was stored under the floorboards interfered with the AE's radios on a secret frequency that the Japanese unloaded from the wreck and put on a submarine then loaded on a copy of the L10E and shipped it all to Saipan just to have it shot down on the way out of Rabaul decades later! WOW! see! we solved it for Cletus!
Brad

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