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Author Topic: Artifact 2-6-S-03A & 2-6-S-03B  (Read 40732 times)

Tim Collins

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Re: Artifact 2-6-S-03A & 2-6-S-03B
« Reply #15 on: May 17, 2014, 02:53:36 PM »

The screw is a wood screw so the mechanism was mounted on wood.

How can you unequivocally say that? What is your evidence for this other than it's a wood screw? Was there a piece of wood attached to them when they were found? Were there traces of wood found on them? Just trying to keep things honest with the facts that's all. 

 
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Chris Johnson

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Re: Artifact 2-6-S-03A & 2-6-S-03B
« Reply #16 on: May 17, 2014, 03:33:59 PM »

I'd be interested to see if anything similar has been found in the village.  I'm thinking of these as 'latches' for screens/windows on houses like the village and also for Gallagher/Planters over near the 7 site.
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Ric Gillespie

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Re: Artifact 2-6-S-03A & 2-6-S-03B
« Reply #17 on: May 17, 2014, 06:40:05 PM »

The screw is a wood screw so the mechanism was mounted on wood.

How can you unequivocally say that? What is your evidence for this other than it's a wood screw? Was there a piece of wood attached to them when they were found? Were there traces of wood found on them? Just trying to keep things honest with the facts that's all.

I choose to think that you meant to say "Just trying to keep things accurate...."
Nothing was attached to either artifact when they were found.  The wood screw associated with the bent "gidgie" has material that appears to be wood imbedded in the threads. Curiously, the threads of the identical wood screw associated with the round "gidgie" have no such impactions and are quite clean.
My interpretation is that the screw on the bent artifact was pried out ( thus bending the artifact) and the other one was unscrewed.
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JNev

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Re: Artifact 2-6-S-03A & 2-6-S-03B
« Reply #18 on: May 18, 2014, 02:59:29 PM »

...and now for the sake of brainstorming (and hoping some might dig into old photos to look for possibilities, etc...) - I've long 'seen' these things as some sort of improvised combination anti-rotation / anchor that might have been mounted to the wood flooring in the Lockheed...

Reckless of me, pure conjecture - I know, but in the interest of spurring interest and a review of whatever material might be seen...

These things REEK airplane - and makeshift to meet some impromptu need, as well - such as could EASILY be the case for a one-off use mission, like produced by hand in a shop somewhere along the way to secure some oddball something while flying around the world in an overloaded Lockheed...
- Jeff Neville

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Ric Gillespie

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Re: Artifact 2-6-S-03A & 2-6-S-03B
« Reply #19 on: May 18, 2014, 04:29:29 PM »

These things REEK airplane - and makeshift to meet some impromptu need, as well - such as could EASILY be the case for a one-off use mission, like produced by hand in a shop somewhere along the way to secure some oddball something while flying around the world in an overloaded Lockheed...

But why would she/he remove them from the airplane and take them all the way to the Seven Site?  What possible utility could they have to a castaway?

I see them as being a home-grown modification to the sextant box (which we KNOW was at the Seven Site).  Recall that Harold Gatty, a world class navigator, said of the sextant box, "... that it was used latterly merely as a receptacle."  Why would he say that?  What was there about the box that told Gatty that it had been used not to carry a sextant but merely as a box to carry things in?
Brandis sextant boxes are outfitted with all kinds of wooden compartments and dividers.  If you wanted to use the box "merely as a receptacle" they would get in the way. Did Gatty see a box that had been gutted of its interior features? 

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Greg Daspit

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Re: Artifact 2-6-S-03A & 2-6-S-03B
« Reply #20 on: May 18, 2014, 05:17:53 PM »

A home grown modification to the Sextant Box that was found in the same area makes sense to me.
As for the modification
I'm thinking outside the box. ;D
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Greg Daspit

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Re: Artifact 2-6-S-03A & 2-6-S-03B
« Reply #21 on: May 18, 2014, 07:28:44 PM »

The screw is a wood screw so the mechanism was mounted on wood.


The wood screw associated with the bent "gidgie" has material that appears to be wood imbedded in the threads. Curiously, the threads of the identical wood screw associated with the round "gidgie" have no such impactions and are quite clean.
My interpretation is that the screw on the bent artifact was pried out ( thus bending the artifact) and the other one was unscrewed.
A few different ideas for why one may have been pulled out and one unscrewed (shoulder strap hypothesis related):
1. The strap may have been meant to be used over one shoulder in a casual way and was a short length, but if the castaway wanted to carry other things or was injured and traveling with a crutch, then he/she may have pulled it over their head and under one arm and bent out one by stretching the strap away from the box. The longer one would bend easier due to more leverage.
2. Based on the bird and fish bone evidence, the Castaway seemed to have stopped moving for some time. The strap no longer useful for to carry places, may have then been removed for some other use.
3. Pulling one out instead of unscrewing it could mean a lack of time to unscrew both. A strap could be used in an emergency to stop bleeding. Lots of small sharks in the Lagoon
4. One may have eventually failed, or partially failed, by pulling out so the other became useless and was unscrewed.
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JNev

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Re: Artifact 2-6-S-03A & 2-6-S-03B
« Reply #22 on: May 19, 2014, 06:24:12 AM »

These things REEK airplane - and makeshift to meet some impromptu need, as well - such as could EASILY be the case for a one-off use mission, like produced by hand in a shop somewhere along the way to secure some oddball something while flying around the world in an overloaded Lockheed...

But why would she/he remove them from the airplane and take them all the way to the Seven Site?  What possible utility could they have to a castaway?

I see them as being a home-grown modification to the sextant box (which we KNOW was at the Seven Site).  Recall that Harold Gatty, a world class navigator, said of the sextant box, "... that it was used latterly merely as a receptacle."  Why would he say that?  What was there about the box that told Gatty that it had been used not to carry a sextant but merely as a box to carry things in?
Brandis sextant boxes are outfitted with all kinds of wooden compartments and dividers.  If you wanted to use the box "merely as a receptacle" they would get in the way. Did Gatty see a box that had been gutted of its interior features?

Certainly possible, Ric, as are lots of things.  I'm not throwing darts at the sextant box idea - I remember that and of course it is possible.

But so might someone remove a floor board and transport it for some reason - something to sit or sleep on, or for rudimentary shade - or any number of other reasons, and organic stuff like wood doesn't last long on Niku, does it?  So we could be seeing the remnants after the wood 'went away' -

Which doesn't fully account easily for the presence of wood fibers still evident in one piece, but not the other - unless they were removed from the wood deliberately by different means (unscrewing in one case, prying in the other).  Or perhaps that was happenstance - one screw could have had a somewhat loose fit originally and never 'took up' much bite from the wood, whereas the one with fibers remaining may have been more tightly bound into the parent structure.

All ideas at this point in my view.  And I've heard from one fellow off-forum who says he seen this kind of stuff all over the place... but what continues to stick out to me is 'yeah, but aircraft aluminum?'  OK, could have been made from aircraft scraps (I'd say 'it is') and we have a number of examples of that from Niku, not necessarily from the Electra - but despite that wise fellow's general observation, these are still peculiarly 'purpose built' for something that may have well been a bit more athletic or dynamic than ordinary household use -

And a sextant box might fit that, as might securing something to the floor of the Electra - or any number of similar things. 

My point was simply to stir interest in looking at possibilities: there could yet be a photo clue out there somewhere.

And the sextant box idea makes sense - it would be far more easily transported and would have far more obvious utility value, in my opinion, than a floor board.
- Jeff Neville

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« Last Edit: May 19, 2014, 06:27:07 AM by Jeffrey Neville »
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Ric Gillespie

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Re: Artifact 2-6-S-03A & 2-6-S-03B
« Reply #23 on: May 19, 2014, 07:26:56 AM »

And I've heard from one fellow off-forum who says he seen this kind of stuff all over the place...

Lots people say that but, so far, nobody has come up with anything that has:
- a wood screw in a hole in
- an aluminum plate with
- little saw teeth and
- a second smaller, but empty, hole

This is reminiscent of the discussions about 2-2-V-1 and the lotion bottle.  To have a viable ID all the features must be present.
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JNev

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Re: Artifact 2-6-S-03A & 2-6-S-03B
« Reply #24 on: May 19, 2014, 10:11:29 AM »

And I've heard from one fellow off-forum who says he seen this kind of stuff all over the place...

Lots people say that but, so far, nobody has come up with anything that has:- a wood screw in a hole in
- an aluminum plate with
- little saw teeth and
- a second smaller, but empty, hole

This is reminiscent of the discussions about 2-2-V-1 and the lotion bottle.  To have a viable ID all the features must be present.

Agreed, and with due respect to the fellow, my point exactly: these things remain oddly unique among all else I've seen suggested, no one has put up anything close "from the outside".
- Jeff Neville

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Chris Johnson

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Re: Artifact 2-6-S-03A & 2-6-S-03B
« Reply #25 on: May 19, 2014, 01:36:16 PM »

Has the wood sample found with the screw been checked out (if possible) to determine type of wood.  I guess a sextant box would be made from a hardwood, which in itself would be rarer on the island as most trees except Kanawa are softwood. 
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Ted G Campbell

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Re: Artifact 2-6-S-03A & 2-6-S-03B
« Reply #26 on: May 19, 2014, 02:57:12 PM »

All,
Do we have a picture of the note passing pole used by AE/FN?
Ted Campbell
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JNev

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Re: Artifact 2-6-S-03A & 2-6-S-03B
« Reply #27 on: May 19, 2014, 03:50:28 PM »

Good thought, Ted... we need to look at that.
- Jeff Neville

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Jeff Victor Hayden

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Re: Artifact 2-6-S-03A & 2-6-S-03B
« Reply #28 on: May 19, 2014, 09:02:48 PM »

This must be the place
 
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JNev

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Re: Artifact 2-6-S-03A & 2-6-S-03B
« Reply #29 on: May 20, 2014, 07:37:15 AM »

Nice find, Jeff Victor.

Was that pole bamboo?
- Jeff Neville

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