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Author Topic: The Dado  (Read 25803 times)

Jeff Victor Hayden

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Re: The Dado
« Reply #15 on: March 23, 2014, 06:40:10 AM »

According to the Fortress Master Log 41-9208 crash landed on Canton 22/06/1942 then, crashed on take-off at Port Moresby 19/09/1942. Which implies that either the records are wrong or, it was repaired.

http://www.91stbombardmentgroup.com/Aircraft%20ID/FORTLOG.pdf
This must be the place
 
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Doug Ledlie

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Re: The Dado
« Reply #16 on: March 23, 2014, 06:29:17 PM »

re the B-24 propensity to break up, here's a controlled ditching test of a specially prepared airframe

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSDa9z4kdOg

Crew must have had 'nads the size of Gardner Island coconuts.....(can I say 'nads on the forum? I guess will find out)

I know C-87 (B-24D) crash at Canton wasn't exactly a controlled ditching but there are still parallels...

Quote
Thinking if this C-87 had the "fancy" interior (including Kapok insulation which I assume to be buoyant ie life preserver?) and if it broke up in the usual fashion, there is at least a good possibility, maybe even likelyhood for "floaters" with relatively light bits and pieces of structure or interior fixtures attached.

I think one of the photos in the link above shows the nav station and it appears to be just ahead of the cargo bay/passenger compartment immediately in front of the wings...so bookcase may have been in general area of where fuselage break up may have happened (if it did in fact break up)


Note that the fuselage fractured right through where the nav station would be in a C-87 and actually looks to be very close to complete detachment...will be interesting to see crash report 

Lots of random torn skin pieces hanging off also
« Last Edit: March 23, 2014, 07:41:02 PM by Doug Ledlie »
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C.W. Herndon

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Re: The Dado
« Reply #17 on: March 23, 2014, 08:14:45 PM »

According to the Fortress Master Log 41-9208 crash landed on Canton 22/06/1942 then, crashed on take-off at Port Moresby 19/09/1942. Which implies that either the records are wrong or, it was repaired.

http://www.91stbombardmentgroup.com/Aircraft%20ID/FORTLOG.pdf

According to the records that I have, found here, the entry below was the fate of B-17E 41-9208. There is no mention of any further happenings.
Woody (former 3316R)
"the watcher"
 
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Jeff Victor Hayden

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Re: The Dado
« Reply #18 on: March 24, 2014, 10:16:19 AM »

Thanks Woody, that's  the same date and location. The mystery is the reported crash on approach to Canton Island in June of the same year for this plane.
This must be the place
 
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Doug Ledlie

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Re: The Dado
« Reply #19 on: March 26, 2014, 07:02:49 PM »

Re Mark's lead-in on this tread, don't know if this photo color is "off" but remnants of material on bulkhead of this discombobulated C-47 appear blue...

http://www.questmasters.us/C-47A_43-15137_Page_2.html

Of course no idea if original material but looks old ;)

Interesting story anyway
« Last Edit: March 27, 2014, 12:09:22 PM by Doug Ledlie »
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Doug Ledlie

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Re: The Dado
« Reply #20 on: March 28, 2014, 09:38:31 PM »

More blue material in a C-47?

http://www.oldwings.nl/content/c47_yic/c47.htm

Magnified fragment from dado/heatshield/whatever-it-is
« Last Edit: March 28, 2014, 09:40:29 PM by Doug Ledlie »
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Doug Ledlie

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Re: The Dado
« Reply #21 on: March 30, 2014, 09:43:14 PM »

Looks like a possible "dado" in this C-47...plywood floor and everything

http://www.propellor.tv/C47%20nosesection.html
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Doug Ledlie

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Re: The Dado
« Reply #22 on: April 01, 2014, 07:11:54 PM »

More ramblings regarding the dado/heat shield in attached pdf

(Did that way to get around attachment limit)

Bottom line, to answer Mark's query at start of thread, I don't think the Sydney Island C-47 can be eliminated as a source
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Mark Pearce

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Re: The Dado
« Reply #23 on: April 01, 2014, 07:44:13 PM »

More ramblings regarding the dado/heat shield in attached pdf

(Did that way to get around attachment limit)

Bottom line, to answer Mark's query at start of thread, I don't think the Sydney Island C-47 can be eliminated as a source

Very interesting Doug!  Many thanks for taking the time to look into this.  DC-3/C-47 parts dealers might be able to give a definitive answer.
 
http://www.centercomp.com/dc3/17.html

http://aeromarineair.com/PARTS_for_SALE.php
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Monty Fowler

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Re: The Dado
« Reply #24 on: April 02, 2014, 06:39:17 AM »

Bottom line, to answer Mark's query at start of thread, I don't think the Sydney Island C-47 can be eliminated as a source

The C-47 kick panel has paint on at least one side of it, appears to be olive drab. If that was the case with the C-47 that crashed on Sydney Island, it has nothing to do with the putative dados from Nikumaroro, which appear to be unpainted metal. Unless someone wants to front the costs for a paint residue analysis?

LTM, who finds dry paint really interesting these days,
Monty Fowler, TIGHAR No. 2189 CER
Ex-TIGHAR member No. 2189 E C R SP, 1998-2016
 
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JNev

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Re: The Dado
« Reply #25 on: April 02, 2014, 06:52:14 AM »

Bottom line, to answer Mark's query at start of thread, I don't think the Sydney Island C-47 can be eliminated as a source

The C-47 kick panel has paint on at least one side of it, appears to be olive drab. If that was the case with the C-47 that crashed on Sydney Island, it has nothing to do with the putative dados from Nikumaroro, which appear to be unpainted metal. Unless someone wants to front the costs for a paint residue analysis?

LTM, who finds dry paint really interesting these days,
Monty Fowler, TIGHAR No. 2189 CER

Maybe the dado is a good candidate to pull into the hyperspectral analysis effort?  I don't know for certain but have some idea that that process might reveal things about paint, dyes and etchings, pitting relevant to same, etc.
- Jeff Neville

Former Member 3074R
 
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Doug Ledlie

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Re: The Dado
« Reply #26 on: April 02, 2014, 09:33:17 AM »

Quote
Maybe the dado is a good candidate to pull into the hyperspectral analysis effort?  I don't know for certain but have some idea that that process might reveal things about paint, dyes and etchings, pitting relevant to same, etc.

Good thought Jeff, caveat being that testing for presence of paint may not result in a useful data point either way since the C-47 parts list does show five different possible part numbers and I doubt it could be determined which version was on the Sydney C-47.  i.e. we don't know (yet anyway) if all versions of C-47 kickplate were painted.  Testing would no doubt still be enlightening though...

My purpose in posting on this thread has been to test the notion (espoused in post 2 on page 1) that the only reasonable source for a dado-like appurtenance with a blue material remnant attached is a Lockheed Electra.  I think the desired point has been made and I trust will be given fair consideration.


Next tangent: Despite the above, I'm not necessarily convinced that the artifact is a C-47 kickplate or a heat shield or whatever simply because its construction doesn't make sense...why would the thing be built so elaborately, ie with micarta electrical insulation between pieces if the intent was anything other than to isolate parts of it electrically.  Could it be somehow related to aircraft radio componentry, cases or installation racks?  Maybe even Coast Guard LORAN or communication radio equipment, disposal of which seems to be undocumented.

Preceding paragraph assumes that the statements about the micarta insulation in Tighar article are factual and not part of what is foot noted as inaccuracy in the article. http://tighar.org/Projects/Earhart/Archives/Research/Bulletins/43_DadoPart1/43_Dado1.html

Also, if just a heat shield, why not just use one piece and bend a 90 on a sheet metal brake rather than build from two pieces
« Last Edit: April 02, 2014, 08:50:32 PM by Doug Ledlie »
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Doug Ledlie

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Re: The Dado
« Reply #27 on: April 23, 2014, 11:03:52 AM »

Perhaps for discussion...would a vertical heat shield even fit in the available space between heat duct and tank?

Crude Photoshop markup suggests maybe not (lots of caveats of course in that I haven't corrected for scale or view angle).  Maybe someone with better photo skills can find a fit.
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Doug Ledlie

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Re: The Dado
« Reply #28 on: April 24, 2014, 10:36:54 AM »

Follow-up to previous...
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Gatorman9

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Re: The Dado
« Reply #29 on: February 12, 2015, 04:05:27 PM »

Ric, the Commemorative (formerly, Confederate) Air Force has a C-87 (name:  "Diamond Lil") which is painted like a B-24 but still has its passenger compartment and windows rather than a bomb bay.  It's been extensively restored over the years and I have no idea if its present condition would help you answer your question.
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