Date:         Wed, 1 Aug 2007 08:50:06
From:         Pat
Subject:      Today's update

I have to be out a lot of the day today so Forum postings will be
delayed, and so will the update. It will go up late in the afternoon
Eastern U.S. time. Sorry!

Pat
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 1 Aug 2007 19:04:38
From:         Pat
Subject:      Daily report up

I've got the daily report up now, have fun.

Pat
=========================================================================
Date:         Thu, 2 Aug 2007 15:30:47
From:         Rick Jones
Subject:      Re: Zippers

A quick look through the Earhart photos online revealed that her ubiquitous
leather jacket had a rather large metal zipper.

http://tinyurl.com/2jtpo3
http://tinyurl.com/2ts6pc
http://tinyurl.com/3bccyv
http://tinyurl.com/34as3m
http://tinyurl.com/yqd9z3
http://tinyurl.com/yqlcjn
http://tinyurl.com/2om44e

It's not apparent to me if this next garment has a zipper, but it looks
somewhat like a zipper pull at the bottom.

http://tinyurl.com/3bms33

Apparently, her flying coveralls had flap pockets with no zippers

http://tinyurl.com/2tuvy9

I also presume Fred's trousers, and perhaps AE's slacks could have had
covered zippers, as could duffle bags, etc.

LTM .

Rick J #2751
=========================================================================
Date:         Thu, 2 Aug 2007 16:26:18
From:         Craig Knowles
Subject:      Re: Zipper

A close-up view of one Purdue photo (thanks Rick Jones) gives a
relatively clear view of the distinct bell shape of the zipper pull
on her leather jacket:

http://tinyurl.com/2gqeft
=========================================================================
Date:         Thu, 2 Aug 2007 16:59:13
From:         Rick Jones
Subject:      Re: Zipper

Here is another good view....I'm amazed at the quality of the photos.

http://tinyurl.com/3duz33

Rick J
=========================================================================
Date:         Thu, 2 Aug 2007 18:09:55
From:         Jackie Tharp
Subject:      Re: Zipper

I thought she sent her leather jacket home from Lae.   They do have
one at Purdue. but I don't know if its the one she was wearing.
Jackie
=========================================================================
Date:         Sat, 4 Aug 2007 22:03:43
From:         William Webster-Garman
Subject:      AP Story

The Associated Press has talked to Ric and published this "wrap-up"
of the expedition:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/worldlatest/story/0,,-6824184,00.html

or

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/08/03/america/NA-GEN-US-Search-
for-Amelia.php
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 5 Aug 2007 10:17:51
From:         Ross Devitt
Subject:      Re: Australian florin

A little bit of trivia for any TIGHARS who don't know about our old
currency.   "Florin" is a funny sounding name.  It was the name given
to a two shilling coin in our pre-decimal days.  The coin was worth
twenty four pennies.  When we changed to decimal currency on the 14th
of February 1966, it and the new twenty cent coin became
interchangeable.  For quite a long time after the change over it was
common to receive a "two bob" coin (Florin) in change.  Gradually the
banks took most of them out of circulation.

Once in a while we still get one.  We can always tell if we have one
of the old coins in our pockets or hands, because they jingle, rather
than clunk due to a high silver content.  A hand full of florins
makes a beautiful sound when shaken.

Cheers,

Th' Wombat

**************************************

Thanks, Ross. One occasionally gets an old quarter or dime in change
here without the copper -- just silver. A different feel, as you say!

Pat
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 5 Aug 2007 21:16:37
From:         Rick Jones
Subject:      Re: more zippers

One more photo showing the zipper on AE's slacks.  Not sure when this was
taken, however.

http://tinyurl.com/3dc5u7

Pat, your daily reports were excellent and much appreciated.  Thank you.  I'm
eager to hear additional details when the team returns.

Rick J #2751

*********************************

Thanks, Rick. I will be putting up one last report tomorrow when Ric
calls from Apia.

Pat
=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 7 Aug 2007 11:26:10
From:         Rick Jones
Subject:      Re: AE's clothing

For Jackie Tharp:  The only reference I was familiar with alluding to personal
effects shipped home from Lae was Elgen Long's "AE, The Mystery Solved", p
190.  Do you know if there may be other clothing items?  Would Purdue have
obtained any of these items other that her leather jacket?  Perhaps a pair of
her slacks?  She seemed to have always worn a similar style, and if so, they
could provide clues to the zipper brand and appearance.  Just a thought.

Rick J
======================================================================== 
Date:         Wed, 8 Aug 2007 11:19:26
From:         Terry Thorgaard
Subject:      Expedition

The latest bulletin reads, in part:

"The Seven Site returned very interesting results, with the outline
of a story appearing in the burn features, fish, bird and turtle
remains, clothing remains. A castaway lived here, ate here - died
here? Did this person die wearing the clothing, which has now
disintegrated completely aside from the metal pieces? "

That it was a castaway remains to be proven.  Someone ate there, but
I'm not sure that evidence of dining, together with pieces of
clothing, conclusively proves that person to be a castaway.  Isn't it
plausible that someone who we know to have been on the island (i.e.
non-castaway, such as a Coast Guard member, for example) lost or
discarded the clothing there?

The list of items Ric is carrying with him is interesting.  Are the
cartridge casings no longer regarded as key artifacts?

************************************

M-1 carbine shells are what the Coasties had, and used extensively
for target practice. They used to sort of shoot skeet by tossing
plates into the air and blasting away.

Pat
======================================================================== 
Date:         Wed, 8 Aug 2007 13:52:56
From:         Mike Piner
Subject:      Seven site

     Indeed we do not "know", for sure if AE & FN were the castaways.
Was this a place that Gallagher had had cleaned so he could get a
good ocean breeze?  What drew us there was the activity in photos,
early photos. Our early investigators were drawn to other sites, that
didn't turn up much.  It was said that the skull was reburied where
the bones were found,  I do not remember how we knew that the place
we called the "skull hole" was the hole where the skull was buried.

     I agree with the Hypothesis. Everything I have been able to read
is plausable.  There are so many detail that are left to the
imagination of the individual.

     I am of the opinion that people came by, saw the airplane,
salvaged it and that is why we cannot find major parts.

     Mike
======================================================================== 
Date:         Wed, 8 Aug 2007 16:44:45
From:         Mike Piner
Subject:      Bottle

     Would the brown bottle in Pic #100 of Purdue University
collection be of any interest? It is in Amelia's hand in this photo.
I know, lots of members have perused these pic in the collection for
clues.
       Mike
======================================================================== 
Date:         Wed, 8 Aug 2007 17:19:00
From:         Jackie Tharp
Subject:      Re: AE's clothing

For Rick Jones

I was mistaken about the jacket.  The one they have in their
collection is suede, and all of the clothing items were
worn by AE during her Atlantic flight.

I didn't get my info from Elgen longs book.  I don't like the way he
states as facts things that are only speculation
on his part.  I got it from the movie "Final Flight" which
was sponsored by Jackie Cochran and I believe George
Putnam was an advisor.  I feel that their movie would have the most
factual details about what was sent home from Lae.

Purdue has a flight suit, slacks, and the suede jacket.
Hope this helps
here is the address:
http://www.lib.purdue.edu/spcol/aearhart/   Then chose
papers, memorabilia and relics from menu
Jackie:)
======================================================================== 
Date:         Wed, 8 Aug 2007 21:39:05
From:         Ron Bright
Subject:      Re: AE's clothing

For Jackie Tharp

     Amelia's leather jacket that she wore on the Atlantic flight was
donated just before the final flight to Carl M. Dunsrud, Meeteetsee,
Wy who in turn donated the jacket to the Buffallo Bill Historical
Center, in Cody, Wy. Also her .22 Winchester, and other memorabilia
from AE is on display. Coincidently a photo of the jacket is on p.
204 of  Osborne's."Courageous Sister", also showing a zipper!

AE commissioned Dunrud to build a summer cabin about 30 miles from
Meeteetsee, the summer of 1936. He had four walls built before she
disappeared. Cody and Meeteetsee both have a big collection of AE
memorabilia, and a big Earhart Festival annually. [ "Let's Go", by
Carl M. Dunrun, published in 1998, a wonderful look at the West and
AEs visit to Wy with GP]

Ron B.
======================================================================== 
Date:         Thu, 9 Aug 2007 17:02:33
From:         Jackie Tharp
Subject:      Re: AE's clothing

For Ron Bright

Hi Ron.  Thanx for your post.  I guess Purdue has AE's clothing info
wrong.  I wonder if the other items are really
from the Atlantic flight now.

Looks like I'm gonna have to add Wyoming to my list
of places to visit in our motorhome.  I'd love to see that
stuff.  Amelia was my kind of woman.  I also have a
.22 Winchester that I use for target practice.  They are
small and slender, perfect for a woman.  The guys at
the target range call me "deadeye"  :):)  because I can
shoot very good using the Winchester and my .22
Beretta pistol, which they say is very difficult to do from
100 yards.

I remember reading about that cabin outside Meeteetsee,
but don't remember where I got that.  I WILL be on the
lookoiut for that book, and again, Thanx for your post.
You always have such interesting information to share.

Jackie:)
======================================================================== 
Date:         Thu, 9 Aug 2007 17:54:38
From:         Ross Devitt
Subject:      Re: Bottle

The bottle is the wrong shape for a Benedictine or Cognac bottle.
The stopper is interesting, as is the outer covering of the lower
half of the bottle.

Curious item.

Th' Wombat

> From Mike Piner
>
>    Would the brown bottle in Pic #100 of Purdue University
> collection be of any interest? It is in Amelia's hand in this
> photo.  I know, lots of members have perused these pic in the
> collection for clues.
>      Mike
======================================================================== 
Date:         Thu, 9 Aug 2007 18:12:56
From:         Ross Devitt
Subject:      About that sextant

In the Purdue collection at the link below (hope it works) is a
picture with the description "Amelia Earhart and Captain Harry
Manning standing near the tail of Earhart's plane and examining a
piece of equipment, ca. 1937".

http://earchives.lib.purdue.edu/cdm4/item_viewer.php?CISOROOT=3D/=20
earhart&CISOPTR=3D271&CISOBOX=3D1&REC=3D2

I'm sure the piece of equipment is an aviation "Bubble Sextant".

Th' Wombat

************************************

Actually an octant.

P
======================================================================== 
Date:         Thu, 9 Aug 2007 18:27:22
From:         George Werth
Subject:      Re: Bottle

This talk about the bottle reminds me of W. C. Fields
when he said, "I'd rather have a bottle in front of me
than a Frontal Lobotomy."

Just couldn't resist throwing that into the discussion!

George R Werth
TIGHAR Member # 2630

LTM who loved a swig from the jug now and then, too!
======================================================================== 
Date:         Thu, 9 Aug 2007 21:07:11
From:         Ross Devitt
Subject:      Re: About that sextant

Just an update, and thanks for the reminder pat, but regardless of
the fact that it was an octant - it was apparently still commonly
referred to as a bubble sextant.  Probably because Army aviators had
enough knobs and dials to learn.  :-)

As everyone knows I stopped posting for a couple of years, but I was
still doing some research trying to identify stuff in the Purdue
collection.  At the time it was nowhere near as comprehensively
annotated.

Going through looking for the bottle mentioned in the earlier post, I
found my notes on the sextant and the links.

Anyway, the unidentified piece of equipment in the Purdue photograph
appears to be an early model  "Bausch & Lomb" bubble sextant model
A-8.  I'm not suggesting this is the sextant belonging to the case
found on Niku, that was supposedly an old fashioned sextant.

This would have been the sort of bubble sextant we discussed and was
probably the sextant/octant Manning would have used on the flight.  I
seem to recall that a bubble sextant was loaned to Noonan for the
flight, but this discussion was a long time ago.

Not sure if we ever actually got to see the difference in appearance
between the bubble unit and the ordinary sextant everyone is familiar
with, so here's Manning's one and an almost identical unit.

The Manning one seems to vary slightly, but the A-8 was modified
continually while apparently retaining the same basic design.

http://www.rossdevitt.com/sextant.html

Th' WOMBAT
======================================================================== 
Date:         Thu, 9 Aug 2007 21:07:46
From:         Ron Bright
Subject:      Re: AE's clothing

Jackie T.,

    I called the Meeteetsee,Wy Historical people and they sent me the
book by "Carl Dunsud", Besides Amelia and GP, and many photos at the
ranch, the book contains other explorations by Putnam. For any
researcher, it should be on the shelf.
   The Meeteetsee Annual Celebration is reportedly  terrific,
including a 30 miles trip up ot AE's cabin, with some of the walls
still there!! And don't forget Cody, Wy, where AE donated her buffalo
skin coat given to her by movie star William H. Hart!
    See also the book "Women Aloft" dated 1981, a Times-Life book,
that contains many artifacts that Amelia carried with her on her over
the water flights, including a medicine bottle.

Ron B
======================================================================== 
Date:         Fri, 10 Aug 2007 07:42:25
From:         Rick Jones
Subject:      Re: Sextant

I would agree with you, Ross, it sure looks like the A-8.  When it was reported
that the team found a brass ring-shaped object, I checked sextants also,
looking for some component or part that resembled the description in the daily
report.  (There is a brass looking item on the A-8, which may be a sun filter or
optic cover that is ring shaped--perhaps there could have been something
comparable on FN's sextant/octant)  I'll be anxious to see the photos when
the team gets home.

Rick J, #2751
======================================================================== 
Date:         Mon, 13 Aug 2007 14:05:28
From:         Gary LaPook
Subject:      Re: Sextant

I agree with you, Manning is holding an A-8. There was a "ring shaped
object" which held a sun filter that was rotated into position. The "ring
shaped object" would have a large round opening where the filter was mounted
and a much smaller hole, off to the side, where it was mounted on the pivot
shaft.

However, Manning receipted for an A-5 sextant prior to the Hawaii flight and
there is certainly a good possibility that this A-5 was loaned to Noonan to
take to Howland. The A-5 does not have a "ring shaped object."
======================================================================== 
Date:         Mon, 13 Aug 2007 14:30:19
From:         Gary LaPook
Subject:      Re: Sextants

Common marine sextants have "ring shaped objects" matching the
description I gave, usually about 6, holding filters for the horizon
mirror and for the index mirror.

gl
======================================================================== 
Date:         Thu, 16 Aug 2007 10:23:32
From:         Rick Jones
Subject:      Tsunami warnings

With the recent spate of earthquakes around the Pacific Rim, those interested
in following Tsunami warnings can look at this web site:

http://www.prh.noaa.gov/ptwc/?region=1

If you are interested in receiving RSS feeds or e-mail notification of Tsunamis
generated, the site below offers very timely bulletins (:15).  I monitored this
site while the team was on Niku.

http://ioc3.unesco.org/itic/contents.php?id=142

Rick J, #2751
======================================================================== 
Date:         Thu, 16 Aug 2007 12:25:12
From:         Tom Hickcox
Subject:      Re: Tsunami warnings

> From Rick Jones
>
> With the recent spate of earthquakes around the Pacific Rim

Given that Niku is fairly small and isolated, how high would a
tsunami come up on it?  Would it just go around, so to speak?

Tom H, #2725

*************************************************

A true tsunami is generated from the ocean floor by plate shifting.
This would be Bad News for Nikumaroro, and other similar islands,
because in profile they are mesas. If you took away all the water
from the surrounding area you'd see that Niku sits like a flat top on
a very steep mountain. Water depth a mile off shore is around 5,000
feet.

So there'd be a LOT of land mass for the wave form to smash against,
and run up and over. Since the highest elevation on Niku is about 17
feet, I don't think there'd be a lot left.

Uh.... at least that's how I understand the dynamics. Randy?

Pat
======================================================================== 
Date:         Thu, 16 Aug 2007 14:25:44
From:         Bob Lee
Subject:      Re: Tsunamis

Not only tsunamis -- significant cyclones (sometimes called 'super
cyclones') like Meena in 2005 have seas at 11+ meters. Meena hit the
Cooks. There's quite a history recently of these super storms in the
area and I see that the recent visit would seem to reinforce the
overwash possibility.

Bob
======================================================================== 
Date:         Thu, 16 Aug 2007 16:41:20
From:         Tom Hickcox
Subject:      Re: Tsunamis

> Uh.... at least that's how I understand the dynamics. Randy?
>
> Pat

My understanding is the opposite.  In an isolated island like Niku,
its profile is narrow enough that the tsunami can split and go around
it.  There really isn't a lot of land mass for the wave to build up
against.

This phenomenon of course is quite different than the storm surge of
a tropical storm.

Tom, #2725
======================================================================== 
Date:         Thu, 16 Aug 2007 22:00:28
From:         Randy Jacobson
Subject:      Re: Tsunamis

Actually, the worst tsunami flow is where the slope off-shore is shallow and
long.  For Niku, you'd see maybe one or two higher waves, but most of the
tsunami would refract around the island.  In deep water, the tsunami height
is about 1-2 cm; it is when it sees a long low slope that the wave height
gets larger due to the run-up and non-intuitive dynamics of waves in deep
vs. shallow water regimes.  With Niku, the transition from deep to shallow
water is so abrupt, that the wave may not even have time or distance to
increase wave height.

*************************************

I stand (or, rather, sit) corrected. Thanks, Randy!

Pat
=========================================================================
Date:         Thu, 23 Aug 2007 13:36:08
From:         William Webster-Garman
Subject:      What a wonderful photo!

I must say this about the photo at

http://www.tighar.org/Projects/Earhart/NikuV/NikuV.html
...
What a wonderful looking crew!

************************************

They are a great bunch.

Pat
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 26 Aug 2007 10:38:10
From:         Tom Doran
Subject:      USS Grunion

People may have heard of the recent discovery of what is believed to
be "almost certainly" the wreckage of the USS Grunion, a sub lost in
the Aleutians in June 1942. There is a non-profit group, headed by
two sons of the sub's commander, which organized the investigation
into the loss of the sub.

I thought there were some interesting parallels to TIGHAR. The group
beleives they foud the sub last year and returned this summer for
more investigaton. The group has a website:

http://www.ussgrunion.com/

Here are some very good quality photos of the wreck, taken in the
last week by a current investigation team.

http://picasaweb.google.com/mbrewsterabele/

Tom D.
Atlanta
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 26 Aug 2007 13:51:13
From:         Dennis McGee
Subject:      Re: USS Grunion

Tom Doran said: "People may have heard of the recent discovery of
what is believed to be "almost certainly" the wreckage of the USS
Grunion, a sub lost in the Aleutians in June 1942."

Wow!  Thanks, Tom!  Those are dynamite photos!!!  Has anyone
identified the rope (??) that is wrapped around the open hatch
cover?  Would this imply that some of the crew had attempted to
escape and secured the hatch to allow others out also??
As usual, another fascinating story from the greatest war in history.

LTM, who always remains surfaced
Dennis O. McGee #0149EC
======================================================================== 
Date:         Wed, 29 Aug 2007 22:03:01
From:         Rick Jones
Subject:      Sextant on E-Bay

C. Plath sextant 3478 turned up on e-bay.  I believe Carl Plath's sextants
were made in Germany.  Pictures included a wooden box with "3478" stamped
on the lid. The box joints did not appear to be dovetailed, however.
I thought it was curious that the number was so close to 3500.

http://tinyurl.com/yqvkvy

Rick J #2751

P.S.  Niku V pictures are spectacular--the tribute to Howard was very
touching.

********************************

Thanks, Rick. I'm trying to get a couple of batches up every day
until they're done.

http://www.tighar.org/Projects/Earhart/NikuV/gallery/photogallery.html
======================================================================== 
Date:         Fri, 31 Aug 2007 10:20:43
From:         Mike Piner
Subject:      Electra photos

I stumbled on a website with lots of photos of Airplanes.  Some
are Electras. Go to :
www.airliners.net/search/indexsearch.main.  click on airplane type,
click L, look for Lockheed, find Lockheed 10 electra,  There are 75
pics of eight different ones has the location.  I suppose all or most
are known by Tighar, but interesting anyway.
======================================================================== 
Date:         Fri, 31 Aug 2007 17:15:04
From:         Tom Doran
Subject:      Re: Electra photos

> From Mike Piner
>
>     I stumbled on a website with lots of photos of Airplanes.  Some
> are Electras. Go to : www.airliners.net/search/indexsearch.main

Nice pictures. The comments about two of the planes indicated they
had been used in re-enactments of AE's round the world flight. One
was by Linda Finch, the other in 1967 by Ann Pellegreno.

Anyone know what either of these ladies actually did? It couldn't
have been the exact route.

Tom Doran, #2796
======================================================================== 
Date:         Fri, 31 Aug 2007 17:31:21
From:         George Werth
Subject:      Re: Electra photos

For Tom Doran:

You write; "Anyone know what either of these
ladies actually did?"

If you Google the two (2) ladies names
you will find several erudite matches.

George Werth
TIGHAR Member # 2630
======================================================================== 
Date:         Fri, 31 Aug 2007 22:37:13
From:         Mike Piner
Subject:      Re: Electra photos

      Ann Pellegreno did not fly across africa, she made a lot of
stops before she got to Karachi.  AE flew across the arabian
pennesula to Karachi.  Ann's stops are given in the piece found by
google. The pacific stops were Lae, Nauru island , Canton Island then
Honolulu.

      Thanks George, for suggesting googling those ladies.  I had
wondered how they compared to AE, I knew they couldn't have refueled
at Howland I.

LTM
                   Mike Piner